Timeshare Terrorism

[RedMan Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RedMan]

Some of these TS Sales Personnel would be great to use as anti terrorist weapons. Some could strike terror in just about anyone. They should be put to good use for fighting fire with fire.

I had my sister and her children join us for a long weekend in one of the pedestal homes at Sunrise Ridge Resort in Pigeon Forge Tennessee. Counting my family, there were eight of us. Upon getting our parking pass, we were offered a breakfast buffet for all eight along with $75. We were told that all they asked was that we stop by and took a look at one of the model units (why would I need to do that???). Although I already knew the answer, I asked what they were selling (since this is a sold out resort). The lady stated that she just made the offers and didn't know much past that. I asked how they could give these things away without selling something to which she replied "because were nice and we just want to darn it" (in a friendly way). We all laughed and went about our business.

The next morning we were sent to Bennett's Barbeque and enjoyed a nice breakfast without even having a rep with us. I guess they saw all the kids and decided to just wait for Auntie to take the kids after breakfast.

After breakfast we went back to the resort to view the model (which we never saw). We were told that we needed to convert to "Global" (RCI) Points like everyone else was doing. We told the man that we were happy with what we have and saw no need to convert anything. He told us that the conversion rate to bring in as many weeks as we wanted was now $4995 (and about to go up to $6995) but for TODAY ONLY we could do this for $3995 and then $2995 (btw: they were offering us 75,000 RCI Points in this super deal). I was laughing inside at this BS. They wanted my Sunrise Ridge deed and my Bluegreen points as well. We were told that since Bluegreen owns half of Casa Del Mar (a sister resort) it was just a matter of time before we would not be able to go there using Amber Points. We were also told that he hoped we liked our deeded week at Sunrise Ridge and better get used to using it because everybody else would eventually convert leaving no inventory for us to use Amber Points (kind of like convert or die).

We told him we would be ok with the deeded week if it came down to that (deeded week 22 is not a bad week and we could also dump it if necessary). And politely told him again that we had no intentions of converting. His boss never even approached us. They just signed off on the paperwork and gave us a check (which paid for most of our groceries).

I will deal with this disaster if and when the time comes that I can't use the timeshare to my liking. I hope that many more will feel the same way I do and hold to their guns. Don't ever let anyone push you into a deal or make you feel like you have to do something right this minute. If you can't have a few days to think over a purchase of anything more than $500 it's probably not worth it. IMHO

Thanks to the information we gain here, we were able to fend off the Timeshare Terrorists this time. I really could care less about their free gifts but I think the experience of talking to them will make it easier and easier to keep saying no in the future and my time is definitely worth what I get for it (sometimes more). There might come a time or times when I may want to buy from a developer but if that time comes I will be prepared for it before hand and know what I want, why I want it, and how much I would be willing to pay (cash speaks loudly). I will never buy because of a "One Day Only" sale.

One day I would like to go into a TS sales presentation wearing a shirt that reads "Buy Resale". I'm sure that would get me out of there fast. It would also be cool to have a beach towel printed the same way to hang over a chair or rail at the pool.

This isn't Paul Harvey, but... GOOD DAY

[taffy19 Gold Contributor Find all posts View Profile Close taffy19]

Some could strike terror in just about anyone.

This isn't Paul Harvey, but... GOOD DAY

I enjoy listening to Paul Harvey every day.
I am glad you knew better than to fall for the salesman's spiel.
How many point systems are there out there anyway and how many do cooperate with each other?

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

Paul, check out these crooks. I think they're selling air

How many point systems are there out there anyway and how many do cooperate with each other?

There must be a couple dozen by now. And that is potentially (and may already be) an unexpected issue in the whole use exchange picture. Many of these are tiny little mini-systems with very little inventory yet people are paying to convert like they are Wyndham or DVC or Starwood. A mini-system with 6 locations and a link to II or RCI is little better than a week to trade on your own especially when you've paid big to gain access.

RCI was the great one stop shop for all weeks - all resorts for many years. The fragmentation we see now does not bode well for ever having that type of selection under one banner again.

I wouldn't even consider a mini with less than 75 resorts as viable. Far too many have that or less. Beware.

As for converting because a weasel says "everyone" is doing it ask yourself "If I never sat down here or listened to this BS what would I be missing? What would change?" The most likely answer is "nothing" - you own and can use whatever you bought whenever and however you bought it so treat the value of what they offer with that in mind. Only if the system you own isn't working for you and the value is there maybe consider it. maybe. And usually at a resale price.

[1950bing Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 1950bing]

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh,
timeshare salesmen seem to never change, and after all these years. My oh my. Timeshare terroist, that's good !

[BoardGirl Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BoardGirl]

...RCI was the great one stop shop for all weeks - all resorts for many years. The fragmentation we see now does not bode well for ever having that type of selection under one banner again.

I wouldn't even consider a mini with less than 75 resorts as viable. Far too many have that or less. Beware. ...

Yeah, RCI as The Place is just ... history. They are still managing to bring in money, but their pitches are entertaining. The fear mongering by the pitchmen is embarrassing.

I have to ask, how many minis have 75 resorts?!? My beloved Bluegreen certainly has less than that, but I don't question their viability as they manage their businesses well (IMO). They don't behave in a 'nickel and dime em' way like RCI does so they can't be that hard up.

Thank you for the educational aspects of your post, also, but I'm curious as to whether you were saying there were a couple dozen point systems or a couple dozen point systems that interoperate with RCI?

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

I have to ask, how many minis have 75 resorts?!? My beloved Bluegreen certainly has less than that, but I don't question their viability as they manage their businesses well (IMO). They don't behave in a 'nickel and dime em' way like RCI does so they can't be that hard up.

Thank you for the educational aspects of your post, also, but I'm curious as to whether you were saying there were a couple dozen point systems or a couple dozen point systems that interoperate with RCI?

I picked 75 as an admittedly arbitrary number. But too much under that and the choices you have as an owner, unless you plan to return to the same areas over and over - are likely to be too limited. Some - like DVC - are a one trick pony and that does have appeal to the right buyers. But usually people buy into a mini to avoid the need for RCI/II and the extra costs they represent. If the pool is limited to 20-30 resorts in a few areas that isn't much better than owning a week at resort X.

I'm not sure exactly how many points systems there are now but in my head I can come up with 20 or so. Of those only 6 or 7 have the 75+ resorts needed, IMO, to offer a true option to a more generic group such as RCI. If you have a small choice internally you end up paying for the points system and the exchange. Not a way to save or simplify the process.

[dougp26364 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dougp26364]

We sort of went through the same thing with Diamond Resorts International (Sunterra) about converting our Polo Towers units to Sun Options. The difference was that it wasn't across the round table but over the phone and I was allowed plenty of time to think about it and research. Of course I knew it was coming before they contacted me so I had a good head start but they still gave me a little more than a week to make my decision.

In the end I went ahead with the conversion. Partly because I liked the options Sun Option will give us (not a great value but options none-the-less), I liked the internal trading (protection for units that look to lose some of their exchange power with newer, bigger, better resorts being built next door) and I the ponits for exchange through I.I. look interguing as well (present Sunterra owners felt they had stronger power after conversion than before). It might be a waste of money but I've wasted money before. After all, it's only money.

I was mostly impressed that I was given time to actually think about what was being offered, ask more questions if I felt like it and trusted to make a decision rather than be pressured to make the decision now or lose the opportunity.

As far as the 75 number, Sunterra lists 94 but some are affiliates and some of those affiliates are listed as limited availability. We also own with Marriott, which has great varity but I don't believe it's over 75 resorts yet. While they are sort of a mini-system with an internal exchange preference they are not a points based reservaiton mini-system. HGVC is one of those mini-systems that has very few resorts of their own and those are only in 3 locations (Orlando, Vegas and Hawaii). They have few affiliates (more if you purchase enough points to be elite) and most of those affiliates are listed as limited availability. If I had it to do all over again, I probably would not purchase with Hilton. We do enjoy our HGVC unit in Vegas and I belive with all the construction going on and planned for the north end it will eventually be one of the better locations in Vegas but, as far as internal exchanging, unless you want to go to Hawaii (and who doesn't) it's not really worth a lot as a mini-system.

[RedMan Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RedMan]

I was mostly impressed that I was given time to actually think about what was being offered, ask more questions if I felt like it and trusted to make a decision rather than be pressured to make the decision now or lose the opportunity.

I think this is key. As for me the "over the phone" sales approach would work much better. Certain personalities react differently to various sales tactics. I tend to sometimes (most of the time) be over cautious and over analytical. This drives my wife crazy!! I will short circuit if someone tries to throw something at me and I don't have time to analyze it to my satisfaction. I'm not sure a week would be enough time for me though. I would have to make a couple trips to the library and find every available web site that deals with the subject.

[dougp26364 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dougp26364]

I think this is key. As for me the "over the phone" sales approach would work much better. Certain personalities react differently to various sales tactics. I tend to sometimes (most of the time) be over cautious and over analytical. This drives my wife crazy!! I will short circuit if someone tries to throw something at me and I don't have time to analyze it to my satisfaction. I'm not sure a week would be enough time for me though. I would have to make a couple trips to the library and find every available web site that deals with the subject.

It actually took me longer than a week. Because of forums like this we had advance notice of the deal going through and then advance notice of the offer being made. Winger was probably the first to post about the offer he recieved and gave me quite a bit of information. For most of the time I was leaning against it. In the end, the amount of points given and changes the exchange companies are making that seem detremental to weeks owners pushed me toward making the change. Even if it was what I conidered a high price.

[RedMan Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RedMan]

As far as the 75 number, Sunterra lists 94 but some are affiliates and some of those affiliates are listed as limited availability. We also own with Marriott, which has great varity but I don't believe it's over 75 resorts yet. While they are sort of a mini-system with an internal exchange preference they are not a points based reservaiton mini-system. HGVC is one of those mini-systems that has very few resorts of their own and those are only in 3 locations (Orlando, Vegas and Hawaii). They have few affiliates (more if you purchase enough points to be elite) and most of those affiliates are listed as limited availability. If I had it to do all over again, I probably would not purchase with Hilton. We do enjoy our HGVC unit in Vegas and I belive with all the construction going on and planned for the north end it will eventually be one of the better locations in Vegas but, as far as internal exchanging, unless you want to go to Hawaii (and who doesn't) it's not really worth a lot as a mini-system.

The Amber system that is attached to our Sunrise Ridge Resort has only three areas to choose from (Pigeon Forge TN, Ormond Beach FL, and Poinciana FL). I like all three areas and bought with that in mind. All are within driving distance. Pigeon Forge being the closest (3.5 hrs.) and the main reason for my purchase (not to mention the killer price and low maintenance fees!). If we only use it for short trips to Pigeon Forge or the deeded week or to rent the deeded week it will be well worth keeping. If it gets to the point that I don't get much use out of it then I might just have to make someone a smokin deal at the pool.

Living in the southeast, we tend to use our Bluegreen Points for our main vacations and so far this is working very well. Bluegreen currently has 26 club resorts and 17 club associate resorts to choose from and I understand they are in the process of adding a couple more club resorts. There is No Way I would pay to convert this ownership to RCI Points. On the other hand, I might consider converting my other ownership to Bluegreen Points but I'm not sure if it would be possible or if it would make sense (again, a couple trips to the library and hours on the Internet doing research ).

[RedMan Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RedMan]

In the end, the amount of points given and changes the exchange companies are making that seem detremental to weeks owners pushed me toward making the change. Even if it was what I conidered a high price.

I can understand this.

My annual membership dues for Bluegreen are mostly eaten up by the included RCI weeks membership. I really wish BG would do away with this because if I had a choice, I would probably not be an RCI weeks member.

[BoardGirl Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BoardGirl]

My annual membership dues for Bluegreen are mostly eaten up by the included RCI weeks membership.

I'm not sure this is true. I would expect that RCI has cut BG a phenomenal deal and that most of what is in the annual fee pays for BG overhead. Now I'm curious enuf to try to find this out!

I do think BG will continue to include an exchange company.

[RedMan Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close RedMan]

I'm not sure this is true. I would expect that RCI has cut BG a phenomenal deal and that most of what is in the annual fee pays for BG overhead. Now I'm curious enuf to try to find this out!

I do think BG will continue to include an exchange company.

You may be right. If you are then I guess it really doesn't matter. This does however make me curious about something else. I will post this on the BG Forum.

[Tom52 Member Find all posts View Profile Close Tom52]

Similar pitch while staying in Gatlinburg

Two weeks ago we checked into TreeTops in Gatlinburg. At check in they sent us over to a lady who said they would like us to do a "survey" with an RCI representative, in exchange for $50 and free breakfast at Bennett's. I asked if this was a pitch to sell timeshares and they said "No, it was only to get feedback from timeshare owners and exchangers to determine how well RCI works for them."

I should have known better. This was a pitch to buy into the Berkeley group/RCI points resort. I got the same scare tactic how in the future I would not be able to get exchanges into other resorts through RCI weeks, or even be able to reserve weeks at my own resort such as Galtinburg Town Square that were already RCI Points resorts. They told me even exchanges through Bluegreen using my points would be greatly limited.

I got out pretty fast once I told them I had recently sold my RCI Points resort as the program just wasn't working form me.

[BoardGirl Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BoardGirl]

Prob'ly the worst sales crap we ever got was at Festiva in Branson. Serious scare tactics about how my BG points would be worthless, but luckily, he's got a guy that can sell them for me TODAY!!!

The guy was shameless. He didn't appreciate my laughing at him. It took hours to later untangle the truth for DH.