Timesharing . . . Has It's Run It's Course?

[ace2000 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ace2000]

As an MBA, you sure don't understand business. You are implying that profits and greed are the same thing. The business of any business is to make money. In other words earning a profit is why any business exists. Their first obligation is to the owners ( shareholders in a public company ). There is nothing wrong about any company boosting its profits as long as it is done legally. That is what they are supposed to do. Your right is to go elsewhere if you don't like what they are doing.

Ever heard of Adam Smith and greed? If you've studied Business at all, then you'll be able to answer your own questions about what I meant. Do a Google Search on it, if you need to.

Did I say there is anything criminally wrong with a company boosting their profits?

IF a company is boosting their profits at my expense, then I have the right to not use that business and I have the right to shop elsewhere. I also have the right to discuss my displeasure in a public forum.

[ace2000 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ace2000]

As an MBA, you sure don't understand business.

One more comment...

Guess Adam Smith (the father of capitalism) didn't quite have a grasp on business either then.

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

Companies are indeed in business to make money, BUT there is a huge difference in those who take a long term approach like Crystal deHaan, the founder of RCI, and the Cendant / Wyndham crowd she sold it to, which thinks only in the short term. deHaan built an RCI that was highly profitable but also realized that RCI's future was dependent on the overall health of the whole system, including financial stability of HOA's and happiness of members. She realized that exclusivity was the glue that held the ownership / exchange model of timesharing, on which RCI's long term health depended, together and did nothing to undermine that. Cendant, on other hand, decided they could boost short term profits by tossing the exclusivity principle out the window and mass market weeks through rentals to the general public. The fact that this will likely kill the golden goose in the long run just does not factor into Cendant / Wyndham's short term thinking. They don't seem to care. Now, the Timesharing Today resort newsletter is estimating that half of timeshare resorts are in serious financial trouble over the next few years. Thanks a lot, Cendent / Wyndham! Timesharing has weathered financial downturns in the past, even thrived during them, but with the new Cendent created landscape, that is not happening this time.

The brave new world of RCI is a long term threat to not only RCI's own financial health, but on a shorter term a threat to timeshare resorts. RCI's short term thinking with hurt more than its own bottom line.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Don't you think they regret having bought a timeshare exchange company, with a fee limit on each sale?

& are doing their best to convert it to purely rental?

One thing about being a worldwide vacation rental company is that it would not carry the negative stigma of being involved with timesharing.

[ace2000 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ace2000]

Don't you think they regret having bought a timeshare exchange company, with a fee limit on each sale?

& are doing their best to convert it to purely rental?

One thing about being a worldwide vacation rental company is that it would not carry the negative stigma of being involved with timesharing.

LOL - if they weren't an exchange company, there would be no inventory. Maybe I'm missing your point.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Maybe I'm missing your point.

True, and I stated my point, that exchanging sets a limit on each sale, which they appear to regret. So they devised a way to get more for exchanges.

Buying an exchange company got their foot in the door, access. Then they took off their chicken suits. (wolf, henhouse)

Someone I trusted once said something like Weeks is a paid-for program . . . it won't be tampered with. Not the exact words, but the meaning. That was awhile back, circa Global Points, when Weeks members raised their concern that they would be forced into Points.

Breach of faith comes to mind . . . .again.

We are all what our experience has made us

[Jya-Ning Silver Contributor Find all posts View Profile Close Jya-Ning]

Don't you think they regret having bought a timeshare exchange company, with a fee limit on each sale?

& are doing their best to convert it to purely rental?

No, I don't think so. A lot of area has much less occupancy rate than if it is operate as TS and exchanges.

A hot summer on the front of beach at great resort may give you $3000 rental, assume they take 40% if they operate on commision base, that is $1,200. But a hot summer at Mexico resort that ask for AI, may only bring them $50 per rental. While with exchange that is $180.

The percentage of any particular resort that can get fetch more than their exchange charge is less than 10%.

A dead season at a resort you may only see 1% occupancy if you operate it as rent. And you very likely see rental rate like $50 per nigh or less for that 1%. Which even with 40% commision, gives them only 140. While if you operate as TS, you will see it occupancy close to 20%, each now gives them about 180. since most people already paid certain MF and will not consider it as cost. They just try to savage some. Even for a shoulder season, you will see TS occupancy rate like 70% while hotel occupancy rate is like 30% with heavy discount.

Plus, as exchange, they will get inventory as free. As rental company, they will only be able to get as commision, and as commision, there will give other company a way to cut in if the rate is too high.

So they will continue operate as rental and exchange. They will try to get some balance to sell the unrentalable week to exchanger as many as possible. While keep the potential rentalable week with highest or reasonable rental income as long as possible.

Jya-Ning

[ace2000 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ace2000]

Has it been a profitable move for them? I'm sure the answer is yes. Then I'd say they don't regret it at all.

Plus, they know they've guaranteed themselves a monopoly with all of the Wyndham points owners. No matter what changes they make in the future to screw over the owners, they'll always have that big percentage of Wyndham owners that will HAVE to use RCI. I know there are some ways around this, but those methods are minimal.

[BobbyO1967 Member Find all posts View Profile Close BobbyO1967]

Ummmm Ace??

The Wyndham points system only works the way it does because of RCI.

Inn Seasons and Disney have also discovered this in recent years.

[BobbyO1967 Member Find all posts View Profile Close BobbyO1967]

Carolinian's paradox

That doesn't happen in the higher point value areas according to both Wyndham and RCI points. Might happen down the food chain some but not here.

Therefore, if it were policy, and if it were driven by greed, wouldn't they do it where it could make the most money??

[BobbyO1967 Member Find all posts View Profile Close BobbyO1967]

The level of untruth

Ace, you continue to throw out statements that are untrue. The person who "came up with" the rental program left a while ago.

The RCI book is more fun to sell. Beyond that, Wyndham can't keep up with itself. Besides, not all Wyndham owners can exchange with each other due to "conversion" issues.

The cost of the exchange is laid out in the rules.

I think you're like on of these talk radio clowns. Say a bunch of stuff that sounds mean and/or edgy, hope no one ever calls you on it.

[bnoble Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close bnoble]

The Wyndham points system only works the way it does because of RCI.

Inn Seasons and Disney have also discovered this in recent years.

Yes, and Disney was so unhappy with it that they renewed their RCI affiliation this past December. That sure showed RCI who's boss!

http://www.marketwire.com/press-rele...nt-1365903.htm

[ace2000 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ace2000]

I think you're like on of these talk radio clowns. Say a bunch of stuff that sounds mean and/or edgy, hope no one ever calls you on it.

I won't dignify your name calling, and won't get down to your level on that comment.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> "Hope no one ever calls me on it?"

I've called you out on several items that you've refused to address in this thread. I've addressed your questions to me.

As for the person who came up with the rental program, can you give us a name of that person? Otherwise, how do we know you're telling the truth?

If you look at my posts, I said the person 'probably' got promoted. I don't think anyone felt like I was saying I knew for sure. Generally, if someone produces a "goldmine" idea in business, they are probably rewarded for it.

Interesting aspect to me... I make my comments and provide reasons why I made those comments and then called names for doing that, by the ones that disagree with my statements.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Interesting aspect to me... I make my comments and provide reasons why I made those comments and then called names for doing that, by the ones that disagree with my statements.

Ya wanna start a club or something?

Maybe this site has gotten a virus from people going back and forth from another site!!!
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Speaking of Disney, which keeps getting thrown out on this forum like Mickey can walk on water, in this particular thread addressing the state of the industry, it should be interesting that DVC is still in the business of selling timeshare only because they have agreed to back 70% of the bad debt that business creates.

I may not be a business genius (more like just an OK business owner/person with a degree in business in economics), but I know lack of confidence in a business venture when I see it. Heck, lenders have more confidence than that in me!

Hey, why can't the timeshares themselves stand as collateral with the lenders!!!???

Of course, Marriott is similarly bally-hooed on these forums, but they just wrote off hundreds of millions of dollars, and stopped all new construction, saying they have enough existing inventory for years (which by the tone of the statement I took to mean forever). That speaks volumes about the profitability of renting lodging as opposed to selling it.

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

Since you don't quote a specific thread, it is hard to tell what you are claiming doesn't happen. If it is rentals, it indeed happens at all points of the food chain. Prime inventory is the main thing RCI rents. I have personally seen that from the exchange deposits at the resort where I was HOA president.

That doesn't happen in the higher point value areas according to both Wyndham and RCI points. Might happen down the food chain some but not here.

Therefore, if it were policy, and if it were driven by greed, wouldn't they do it where it could make the most money??