Deed-Backs

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

Acadia Village Resort is Maine takes deed backs if all taxes and balances are paid off for a fee of $ 350. As far as I know there has been no mass exodus. If all resorts did something like this, the "postcard" companies would have almost no chance of fleecing a few thousand more from owners that want out.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Acadia Village Resort is Maine takes deed backs if all taxes and balances are paid off for a fee of $ 350. As far as I know there has been no mass exodus. If all resorts did something like this, the "postcard" companies would have almost no chance of fleecing a few thousand more from owners that want out.

Can I hear an Amen!

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

Acadia Village Resort is Maine takes deed backs if all taxes and balances are paid off for a fee of $ 350. As far as I know there has been no mass exodus. If all resorts did something like this, the "postcard" companies would have almost no chance of fleecing a few thousand more from owners that want out.

And then what do they do with them?

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

And then what do they do with them?

Use your gray matter.

Life is full of option.

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

And then what do they do with them?

Resell them if they can.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Acadia Village Resort is Maine takes deed backs if all taxes and balances are paid off for a fee of $ 350. As far as I know there has been no mass exodus. If all resorts did something like this, the "postcard" companies would have almost no chance of fleecing a few thousand more from owners that want out.

Here I was speculating that it might be the end of timesharing, but maybe not. So, it sounds like a fair and decent exit strategy, owners giving up everything they have put into it, and just giving it back.

I can see how that might work in some areas, areas where there is real market value, but in the overbuilt areas we all know about, I can see it being a problem. OTOH, if they (sales weasels) put our money where their mouth is, they should be happy to get them back for free.

doncha think

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

It occurs to me that I am suggesting what some on this forum have suggested that I am not willing to do, try do something a different way.

If thinking only inside the box does not resolve the deliquency problem for some resorts, maybe they need to think outside the box.

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

In overbuilt areas they could try marketing them in an exit strategy. Can't afford $25k, how about an older unit repo for $ 8 k---let me see if we have one in stock.

[Ridewithme38 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ridewithme38]

In overbuilt areas they could try marketing them in an exit strategy. Can't afford $25k, how about an older unit repo for $ 8 k---let me see if we have one in stock.

I was just offered that at Massanutten around $8,000 for a ts that had been 'deeded back'...BTW: i think a NY Accent and a typical NY Condescending attitude helps at these sales meetings....he couldn't wait to get rid of me even after he had convinced my 6yr old to say 'Daddy you HAVE to buy this!"

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

In overbuilt areas they could try marketing them in an exit strategy. Can't afford $25k, how about an older unit repo for $ 8 k---let me see if we have one in stock.

That's been done for as long as went on tours, 20 years or so.

There was always one they "just took in on trade" for a little less.

But, you know that.

[Will Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Will]

The comment about the need to think outside the box at this point is exactly right. This has been my disagreement with Timeos2, who is clearly very knowledgable and does make a great deal of sense. I have also discussed this same point with him on a different forum I used to contribute to. At the present time, I think that the enormity of the problem is such that it will devastate the timeshare market unless a business as usual approach is modified. So new ways of thinking are essential.

In the interest of thinking outside the box, I wonder if a more contained and limited start up approach to a buy back program would add some appeal to its detractors. An HOA adpots a policy that it will carry up to 5% of the total inventory in a take back account. After that point a waiting list is created. As units are sold or given away from that account, units are taken back from the waiting list. Units in the account could be given to other owners, or sold to new people. The 5% limit would keep the potential floodgates closed, but owners wanting out would get some hope.

The whole point of a buy back program, including this variant, is to restore confidence in the timeshare market. It is important to remember that this is the objective, and not a desire to help people evade their obligations. In my view confidence will be hard to achieve if people feel trapped forever, to the point that they will pay thousands just to in the hope of getting out. Very few people would take on a new obligation under those circumstances. So the problem is perpetuated.

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

Nicely stated, Will. I like the idea of limiting the HOA inventory. The sales of postcard weeks also tends to devalue the timeshare weeks, particularly now when even some decent weeks are selling for $ 1 on EBAY. Foreclosures will cost the HOA more than a deed-back as fees will generally be in arrears. The success or failure of a deed back program will be determined by whether the HOA can sell those weeks in inventory by whatever means they can.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Now we're up to three . . . .

Referring to my comments about the high level of delinquencies at one of our resorts, and the ominous letters we get from the Interval association, and the first-time-ever special assessment for 2012 because of delinquencies, I read the 2011 general meeting minutes online yesterday and it was overflowing with positivity. It talked about all of the units that have been purchased from delinquent owners by new owners, how the two biggest delinquent accounts are being worked out, etc.

Of course, those comments were coming from the head of the HOA, the full-ownership group that the IOA reports and pays to. She and her husband have been accumulating units at the resort and have the highest delinquency.

.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

In overbuilt areas they could try marketing them in an exit strategy. Can't afford $25k, how about an older unit repo for $ 8 k---let me see if we have one in stock.

I believe the first group I suggested doing that (handling resale weeks for current owners) was WasteGate. Whether them or others, they always said it was a conflict for them to handle their own and owners weeks. I took that to mean they would not have 75% commissions on owner weeks.

Then, before I started my present career, I answered an ad placed by the new-at-that-time sales manager at a local resort we now own at (for non-timeshare reasons) because it said they were looking for new people with new ideas. I suggested I handle nothing but resales, as an exit strategy as Tony suggests.

I wasn't interested in the big bucks, so I had no conflict. I liked timeshares, had 80 or 90 wondeerful vacations to talk to folks about, and wanted to do something that actually benefitted all involved. That resort actually has/had a resale for market at $6000-9000 per week, but just needed someone to organize the sellers and work a system.

Of course, that sales staff is now long gone and the only sign of sales is a sign that says Timeshare Weeks $2500. Even the unusual resale market there is gone now because of the stigma of it being timeshare. Vacant Lots with higher fees ($100 a month) and no benefits are more marketable.

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

Do the documents each and every interval agreed to at purchase clearly state that 5% (or 1 or 10 or whatever the %) will be automatically held as Association weeks and the costs covered by the other owners?

If not it cannot be legally done. You'll have to get an amendment to the Association documents to allow it. Lots of luck with that for most resorts.

All this talk made me re-read the policies at the resorts I own. As it turns out there are deed back provisions clearly spelled out. So the "answer" already exists. But it requires that the account(s) go through collections and be in line for foreclosure before the provisions kick in. That is done so the majority of owners - that PAY - are protected and not buried in easy to do deed backs. It makes the owners more likely to look for buyers rather than go through the steps but the option is there. It is fair to all exactly as it is supposed to be in condo law.

Giving owners an easy way to dump their willfully accepted obligations by forcing them on unwilling owners is never a legitimate answer unless those owners agree to it.

Plus lumping all resorts into the so called problem also isn't realistic. Each resort is a unique case as location, size, age and more all may mean a resort is extremely viable or barely able to hang on. One size or answer does not fit all.