Some Just Don't Get it . . .

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

There were two timeshares on Cape Cod that combined recently. Does anyone know how they accomplished it, and how many owners had to agree?

I'll have to look up Stuart ''The Bullfrog'' Lamont; I'm not familiar with him.

These were two associations with locations not too far apart that had to vote to disband in one case & allow transfer of ownerships to a different resort in the other. The closing had to get a super majority vote (51% yes of 70% of all owners I believe) while the combining only needed a simple majority. They (VRI) really pushed it & what the benefits would be and got both Associations to agree. It wasn't easy but it happened fast. Now they have to sell the closed property which is the last step. They have had offers I hear. If they had two different managements I don't know if it would have happened.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

So, why no compassion for those who have supported the industry with their $$$ all these years, no longer want the damn things, and the industry provides no way to get out?

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

So, why no compassion for those who have supported the industry with their $$$ all these years, no longer want the damn things, and the industry provides no way to get out?

It's really TWO industries. The builders/management of the original resort and then the Associations. The second group had no part in the creation & rules - they merely exist to operate the resort and really have notjing to do with how it came about or what the rules say. The key ones they can't even change due to laws.

So blaming or putting responsibility on the second group is basically unfair & non-productive. They have no deep pockets like developers/management firms - they only exist for & can get income from the owners. Many of whom can't be bothered to vote once a year so forget them taking any positive action to address an issue. It is the wrong group to deal with unfortunately.
I know we've been around & around on this but the Associations just aren't the bad guys (assuming they are independently controlled. verything changes if they are still under the thumb of the original or subsequent developer ie Wastegate and far too many others).

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

It's really TWO industries. The builders/management of the original resort and then the Associations. The second group had no part in the creation & rules - they merely exist to operate the resort and really have notjing to do with how it came about or what the rules say. The key ones they can't even change due to laws.

So blaming or putting responsibility on the second group is basically unfair & non-productive. They have no deep pockets like developers/management firms - they only exist for & can get income from the owners. Many of whom can't be bothered to vote once a year so forget them taking any positive action to address an issue. It is the wrong group to deal with unfortunately.
I know we've been around & around on this but the Associations just aren't the bad guys (assuming they are independently controlled. verything changes if they are still under the thumb of the original or subsequent developer ie Wastegate and far too many others).

You keep saying that when no one is blaming your group.

I believe I said industry.

If you wish to keep including yourself, and be defensive, deflective, that's your own doing.

You really don't have to any more. I know you are not going to come up with an answer for all those who just want out.

Now, back to the question . . .

why no compassion for those who have supported the industry with their $$$ all these years, no longer want the damn things, and the industry provides no way to get out?

See, I did say industry.

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

I don't take it as any type of attack. I'm just saying that the industry you refer to is the developers/sales/management. It is NOT the Associations who, maybe not in your case, get caught in the middle as being the "problem".

I'm just saying they are not and that lumping them into an "industry" segment that they are actually not a true part of is the wrong way to go. If you don't mean to include them I apologize. Others do it seems.

[PigsDad Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close PigsDad]

why no compassion for those who have supported the industry with their $$$ all these years, no longer want the damn things, and the industry provides no way to get out?

The answer is simple: there is no profit in it.

One may not like the answer, but that is the answer. In a Utopian world, companies would care about more than profit, but we are far from that.

Kurt

[bravesfan Member Find all posts View Profile Close bravesfan]

Now, back to the question . . .

why no compassion for those who have supported the industry with their $$$ all these years, no longer want the damn things, and the industry provides no way to get out?

See, I did say industry.


[/QUOTE]

I bought my house at a crappy time at a historically low interest rate can you have some compassion for me and subsidize my loan please? I have supported the HOA, been good to the industry can you please have some compassion on me

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

There were two timeshares on Cape Cod that combined recently. Does anyone know how they accomplished it, and how many owners had to agree?
.

Closing a resort is the trickier part. Resorts fall into one of two categories, either they are under the Uniform Condominium Act, which all states have now adopted, if their resort was organized after the effective date of that act in their state, or if organized earlier, it would fall under the preceding legislation which goes by various names in various states. In North Carolina, it is the Unit Ownership Act. That preceding legislation is based on one of two models, either the Puerto Rico Condominium Act or the HUD model condominium act. Most, including North Carolina, are under the latter.

The HUD model act requires unanimous consent at most junctures to close a condominium including a timeshare, but has some loopholes like if a resort is substantially destroyed or at set intervals after the condominium has been around a set number of years (30?). In the later case, some Declarations of Covenants have added a further hurdle, required one years notice or the like prior to any vote on the subject, so if you miss the window to give notice, there is no vote.

The Uniform Condominium Act, on the other hand provides for closing a resort based on a supermajority vote, but since that is based on a supermajority of all eligible voters instead of a supermajority of those actually voting, even that is hard to obtain.

The other problem in closing a resort is that once the condominium is dissolved, all owners become tenants in common and any one can file an action to sell the property at the courthouse door. Of course, if they convey it in trade for another unit at another resort, the deed goes out of their name into the new owner. If everything is going to a new HOA, they can probably get away with taking the deeds into the HOA, as another wrinkle is that when a non-profit like an HOA is wound up, its assets have to go to another non-profit.

The big problem with trying to combine two resorts is that there is unlikely to be nearly enough high season weeks to cover both resorts high season owners. The weak link in resorts is in the off season, particularly deep off season, and particularly among those who own to exchange as opposed to owning to use.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

I don't take it as any type of attack. I'm just saying that the industry you refer to is the developers/sales/management. It is NOT the Associations who, maybe not in your case, get caught in the middle as being the "problem".

I'm just saying they are not and that lumping them into an "industry" segment that they are actually not a true part of is the wrong way to go. If you don't mean to include them I apologize. Others do it seems.

As was said back in the day when we had long hair, or some hair, "If you are not part of the solution . . ."

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Timeshare companies, lenders, and other @$$#&!%$, sure, but why don't we here?

I'm trying to make a list of all things that you are forced to keep, and keep paying on, after you know longer want, need, or use it, and my list is pretty short:

Timeshare

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

Timeshare companies, lenders, and other @$$#&!%$, sure, but why don't we here?

I'm trying to make a list of all things that you are forced to keep, and keep paying on, after you know longer want, need, or use it, and my list is pretty short:

Timeshare

Homes
Condos
Vacation Homes
Vacant lots
Rural property

The above can be "forever" if they can't be sold (look at Detroit) at any price
No one guarantees a market for any of them - just like timeshares! If you accept a deed you accept the taxes/maintenance/HOA fees/lawsuits - whatever. Until someone takes the deed over - through foreclosure or lawsuit - you have the responsibility. Just like timeshare. It's not unique there are just more areas they exist and overall more of them because they tend to be spread one "unit" (be it a lot/home/parcel/condo/timeshare week) over 52 possible owners vs one. The parallels are there as that is how timshares were designed to mimic. Maybe they did it too well

Term contracts (ie home security systems, cable / satellite, magazine subscriptions - yes they all have a potential end date but perhaps not when you want/need it)

Cars (unless you PAY to get rid of the really unwanted/unusable ones)

Saying timeshare is unique is a straw man argument. It's just not true. There are just more of them viewed as a problem. If every unwanted timeshare was instead an old factory or lot in Detroit the exact same issue would exist. It's deeded property nobody wants and there is no market. So we should be handling that too? Yes it's an issue. No it's not unique or special.

[singlemalt_18 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close singlemalt_18]

I'm trying to make a list of all things that you are forced to keep, and keep paying on, after you know longer want, need, or use it, and my list is pretty short:

Timeshare

I'm not sure the problem is one of a lack of compassion. I think there is a case to be made with this issue - as well as others being mentioned - for the law of unintended consequences.

Early timeshare interests were sold with finite lifespans of 25 or 30 years. A big selling point became the fee simple ownership that was "forever"... you know, the old "you can pass this on to your kids and grandkids!" routine.

The permanent type of "forever" ownership was seen as desirable, and the only smart way to own over temporary "schemes". So be careful what you wish for.

Who would have imagined that a buyback provision or guarantee was something that the boomers (who by the way are the first generation of mankind that was to remain young and vibrant, and live forever) would have even nominal interest in? Think back 10 to 15 years; would anyone have been willing to pay a premium to obtain some type of buyback option that would kick in, say, after 20 years? I doubt it.

If you can pass it on to your kids... why would one even consider it? Now the darn kids we spoiled turn their noses up at something so "yesterday". And who could have imagined that such a glut of timeshare (or condos in Florida) could have ever been built? The cash-out housing bubble decade enabled everyone to buy that dream vacation "property" like so many other items - nearly NO MONEY DOWN !!!!

As with the best laid plans, things don't turn out as we expect or imagine. To play devils advocate, I'm trying to come up with a list of things you can buy to keep and use for some undefined period of time, and still have the option to sell back to the manufacturer or distributor whenever you don't want it anynore...

My list has one fewer items than yours.

I'll say it again; its a love/hate thing.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Homes
Condos
Vacation Homes
Vacant lots
Rural property

All of these have an exit strategy. All have a legitimate resale structure. None of them intentionally stick you with them.

But, of course, anyone can come up with an examples in each of them where someone has bought something they can't get rid of.

Nothing on your list has the negative connotation among the general public that timeshares do.

And, as you know, if you are inviting millions of owners to just walk away, your list would have plenty of them, too.

As some have said, you can even get rid of a piece-o-crap car, and get money for the metal.

Seems like every thread winds up being a no-exit-strategy thread, regardless of how it starts.

This one started with the notion that those that don't get it, don't seem to realize that we are all in this together. Every owner who drops out, or wants to drop out and can't, or no longer deposits their week, or is removed from the lineup for whatever reason, makes the team weaker.

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

Trying to make it unique when its neither new or different doesn't work. How is the "exit strategy" any different for the abandoned & unmarketable property and the loan and/or taxes due any different than an unwanted timeshare? Strawman.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Think back 10 to 15 years; would anyone have been willing to pay a premium to obtain some type of buyback option that would kick in, say, after 20 years?

As the new breed of owners seems to be unwilling to even acknowledge would be a good thing, despite copious warnings.

Thus, the title of the thread.