Ebay seller HELP

[reloader Member Find all posts View Profile Close reloader]

Was looking on ebay and came across this seller
43namal witha 100% feedback on 708.His shop is www.timeshareweb-43.Is he reputably his prices seem almost too good(how does he manage this).Payment is by paypal credit card and money is held escrow.He seems to tick all the right boxes Final payment is stated as well.Quite fancied the mystic dunes but i'll hang fire til i see what you guys come back with.
Thanx as ever a newbie whose learning fast(or gettin more confused by the day!!!!)
ps he uses timeshare closing company

[Bill4728 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Bill4728]

He is legit!

BUT he is what is called a "postcard company" - PCC. He gets his inventory by telling unhappy owners lies. They then pay him ( yes? they pay him!) up to $4000 to take their TS off their hands. He then turns around and sell them cheap on the internet. Many of us have bought from him and his related companies but most feel bad about buying from someone who basically conned someone out of their TS. ( he goes to great lenghts to say he isn't a PCC, BUT we all come to know he is a PCC.)

If you feel comfortable about buying from someone like that, then OK go for it! but many people don't feel right about someone who gets his inventory conning people.

[JudyS Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close JudyS]

I believe that he is part of VIN (Vacation Innovations Network.) They are a big postcard company. As long as you are comfortable buying from a postcard company, he should be OK to buy from.

[Hounddog01 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Hounddog01]

Just a question, Why would you not want a good deal. I understand that there may be a con, but it was a con when they bought it at full retail isn't that as bad?

If I can buy something that I will use and only pay $1 or $100, why not buy it? Someone will and they will get the good deal not you.

[jericap Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close jericap]

Houndog,
I have bought on Ebay and have gotten some pretty good deals. I feel if someone is going to buy it, it may as well be me.
But, some people feel that the way some companies obtain the "good" deals is truly unethical, although it is just on this side of legal. I do agree with that point, but as a realist, I feel as I stated above.
There are individuals that really don't know alot about timeshares and they pay their maintenance fees every year and do nothing with it. There are various reasons why people just want to get rid of them at any cost.
I do agree with your point about buying a timeshare from a developer, they tell the same story, slightly different context.
I have bought all my timeshares (6) through many different means...1 developer, (have learned since then) 2 ebay, 2 holidaygroup.com, 1 redweek.
There is no right or wrong decision, just as long as you're comfortable with whatever your choice is.

[Hounddog01 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Hounddog01]

I was just wondering. I understand better now. I do not like to see anyone taken advantage of. I have sit thru several "presentations" just for the freebies. I'm sure most everyone has and just said no. Now that I am a little older and want to travel more I am just looking for a few in places I want to go.

[Theo Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Theo]

Ethics vs. bargains

Re: >> If I can buy something that I will use and only pay $1 or $100, why not buy it? Someone will and they will get the good deal not you. <<
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The question which you need to ask and answer for yourself is (assuming for the sake of discussion that the subject entity is indeed a PCC --- and I don't claim to know) is whether or not you are morally or ethically bothered by doing business with someone who has essentially already received a few thousand dollars to "take that timeshare off someone's hands". If they sell it to you for $1.00, they STILL already made that other few thousand dollars.

A bargain for a eBay buyer? Maybe.....but do you really want to help keep those PCC people (with some difficulty, I'm refraining from using a different word other than "people"....) in business? That's an individual question which each of us must answer for ourselves......and then answer to ourselves after having made the decision.

[Hounddog01 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Hounddog01]

Re: >> If I can buy something that I will use and only pay $1 or $100, why not buy it? Someone will and they will get the good deal not you. <<
================================================== =====

The question which you need to ask and answer for yourself is (assuming for the sake of discussion that the subject entity is indeed a PCC --- and I don't claim to know) is whether or not you are morally or ethically bothered by doing business with someone who has essentially already received a few thousand dollars to "take that timeshare off someone's hands". If they sell it to you for $1.00, they STILL already made that other few thousand dollars.

A bargain for a eBay buyer? Maybe.....but do you really want to help keep those PCC people (with some difficulty, I'm refraining from using a different word other than "people"....) in business? That's an individual question which each of us must answer for ourselves......and then answer to ourselves after having made the decision.

I see your point. Do you feel the same way about the developers who sell a timeshare week for $10,000 to $15,000 dollars? I do not believe most who purchase at these prices know (and are not told) that the property will be worth pennies after the sale. I guess unless you buy from the developer anyone who sells looses money. It seems in this industry that the unethical treatment starts from the beginning to the end.

[Arkansas Winger Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Arkansas Winger]

If you have a problem buying from a Postcard company. Then you had better stay off of ebay. I would be willing to wager over 90% of the listing on ebay are PCC listings.

Personally, I look at it this way. The developer robs you if you can't say NO! The PCC robs you if you are to lazy to find out how to get rid of something you don't want with paying someone to take it off your hands.

And as a buyer if I pay more than is necessary to get what I want, then then I either have more money than I need or I haven't researched the market on what I am looking for.

If you have something to sell. I may not like you, may even despise you. But, if what you have is what I want then and I can't get it elsewhere for the price I want it for, we will complete the transaction at the price I am willing to pay.....

Re: >> If I can buy something that I will use and only pay $1 or $100, why not buy it? Someone will and they will get the good deal not you. <<
================================================== =====

The question which you need to ask and answer for yourself is (assuming for the sake of discussion that the subject entity is indeed a PCC --- and I don't claim to know) is whether or not you are morally or ethically bothered by doing business with someone who has essentially already received a few thousand dollars to "take that timeshare off someone's hands". If they sell it to you for $1.00, they STILL already made that other few thousand dollars.

A bargain for a eBay buyer? Maybe.....but do you really want to help keep those PCC people (with some difficulty, I'm refraining from using a different word other than "people"....) in business? That's an individual question which each of us must answer for ourselves......and then answer to ourselves after having made the decision.

[Theo Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Theo]

Invalid comparison

Re: >> Do you feel the same way about the developers who sell a timeshare week for $10,000 to $15,000 dollars? I do not believe most who purchase at these prices know (and are not told) that the property will be worth pennies after the sale. <<
================================================== =======

With all due respect, you're comparing apples with oranges in posing this question this way.

In developer sales, the developers are FIRST recouping the costs of having constructed the facility in the first place (the resort didn't just build itself). They then have to market the property. Some folks know exactly what they are buying, intend to use it themselves for years to come, don't regard it as an "investment" on which there will ever actually be any financial return --- only personal use and enjoyment which, over the years, has an accrued value of its own, though that's certainly hard to quantify in terms of dollars.

In the resale market, far more often than not, the resort has long since been "sold out" (i.e., all units originally offered were sold) and the developer is usually no longer even in the picture --- profits were pocketed and the developer is long gone. However, due to changing circumstances in peoples' lives (death, divorce, old age, alien abduction, financial reversals, etc.) the timeshare (now a "used" or "resale" product....) is no longer of use or interest to them -- it's just an ongoing expense sending annual maintenance fee bills. At this point, however, the timeshare has only "marketplace" value, surely just a fraction of the original purchase price when originally purchased "new".

The developer and / or their sales reps are in business in a free enterprise system --and for profit. Let me be clear that I have no use for their sleazy sales "tactics", sometimes involving outright misrepresentation or deceit, but I must nonetheless acknowledge that it is still not THEIR responsibility to educate ANY prospective buyer about the resale market. It's every consumer's personal responsibility to enter the marketplace informed and with both eyes open. Does it take some homework and some effort? Yes, it surely does. But failure to become properly informed before entering shark infested waters is a personal choice and decision. The sharks are not actually responsible for warning their unsuspecting prey.........

CAVEAT EMPTOR -- Buyer Beware.

[brennumtimesharer Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close brennumtimesharer]

Just a question, Why would you not want a good deal. I understand that there may be a con, but it was a con when they bought it at full retail isn't that as bad?

If I can buy something that I will use and only pay $1 or $100, why not buy it? Someone will and they will get the good deal not you.

A number of people feel that the postcard companies lies are bad while the developers lies are just business. I, for one, don't agree. In my opinion, the postcard companies get paid to assume a risk. Sometimes they make a lot of profit on a transaction, sometimes they make a little.

Aside from the developer lies there are many web sites charging people upfront fees from $1000 to $3000, I believe Pinnacle is one that charges the high end, to list an timeshare for sale. They then proceed to do as little as possible to sell the unit. In the case of Pinnacle, I have been told to not even bother making an offer less than $3000 as that was the amount they charged the seller.

I have bought from LAMAN which is an Ebay Seller id from the same company as NAMAL. The only thing I would caution is to be very detailed in verifying all information on the sale. One auction I won turned out to be totally misquoted and I didn't get the facts until after the timeshare closed. They did make good in buying it back for the purchase price.

Good luck Reloader.

Bill

[brennumtimesharer Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close brennumtimesharer]

Re: >> Do you feel the same way about the developers who sell a timeshare week for $10,000 to $15,000 dollars? I do not believe most who purchase at these prices know (and are not told) that the property will be worth pennies after the sale. <<
================================================== =======

With all due respect, you're comparing apples with oranges in posing this question this way.

In developer sales, the developers are FIRST recouping the costs of having constructed the facility in the first place (the resort didn't just build itself). They then have to market the property. Some folks know exactly what they are buying, intend to use it themselves for years to come, don't regard it as an "investment" on which there will ever actually be any financial return --- only personal use and enjoyment which, over the years, has an accrued value of its own, though that's certainly hard to quantify in terms of dollars.

In the resale market, far more often than not, the resort has long since been "sold out" (i.e., all units originally offered were sold) and the developer is usually no longer even in the picture --- profits were pocketed and the developer is long gone. However, due to changing circumstances in peoples' lives (death, divorce, old age, alien abduction, financial reversals, etc.) the timeshare (now a "used" or "resale" product....) is no longer of use or interest to them -- it's just an ongoing expense sending annual maintenance fee bills. At this point, however, the timeshare has only "marketplace" value, surely just a fraction of the original purchase price when originally purchased "new".

The developer and / or their sales reps are in business in a free enterprise system --and for profit. Let me be clear that I have no use for their sleazy sales "tactics", sometimes involving outright misrepresentation or deceit, but I must nonetheless acknowledge that it is still not THEIR responsibility to educate ANY prospective buyer about the resale market. It's every consumer's personal responsibility to enter the marketplace informed and with both eyes open. Does it take some homework and some effort? Yes, it surely does. But failure to become properly informed before entering shark infested waters is a personal choice and decision. The sharks are not actually responsible for warning their unsuspecting prey.........

CAVEAT EMPTOR -- Buyer Beware.

With all due respect, I disagree.

Have you ever been through a presentation. I assume you have been through many as have I. While there are a few resorts that are classy and have honest and truthful sales staff. The remainder however present a lot of "Facts" that once you leave after buying turn out to be 1/2-1/4 truths i.e. lies.

Then you have resorts offering you features that come with your purchase that in effect you paid for that suddenly are transferrable when you sell it. Kind of like buying a car from a dealer and when you go to sell it the dealership shows up to reclaim the engine.

There are lies on all sides of the timeshare game. Those who don't take the time to study up on the front or back end of a purchase will get burned. People who do understand the game will be on the profit end of the transactions.

My question is that of all your ownerships have all been from the developer?

Bill

[Hounddog01 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Hounddog01]

Re: >> Do you feel the same way about the developers who sell a timeshare week for $10,000 to $15,000 dollars? I do not believe most who purchase at these prices know (and are not told) that the property will be worth pennies after the sale. <<
================================================== =======

With all due respect, you're comparing apples with oranges in posing this question this way.

In developer sales, the developers are FIRST recouping the costs of having constructed the facility in the first place (the resort didn't just build itself). They then have to market the property. Some folks know exactly what they are buying, intend to use it themselves for years to come, don't regard it as an "investment" on which there will ever actually be any financial return --- only personal use and enjoyment which, over the years, has an accrued value of its own, though that's certainly hard to quantify in terms of dollars.

In the resale market, far more often than not, the resort has long since been "sold out" (i.e., all units originally offered were sold) and the developer is usually no longer even in the picture --- profits were pocketed and the developer is long gone. However, due to changing circumstances in peoples' lives (death, divorce, old age, alien abduction, financial reversals, etc.) the timeshare (now a "used" or "resale" product....) is no longer of use or interest to them -- it's just an ongoing expense sending annual maintenance fee bills. At this point, however, the timeshare has only "marketplace" value, surely just a fraction of the original purchase price when originally purchased "new".

The developer and / or their sales reps are in business in a free enterprise system --and for profit. Let me be clear that I have no use for their sleazy sales "tactics", sometimes involving outright misrepresentation or deceit, but I must nonetheless acknowledge that it is still not THEIR responsibility to educate ANY prospective buyer about the resale market. It's every consumer's personal responsibility to enter the marketplace informed and with both eyes open. Does it take some homework and some effort? Yes, it surely does. But failure to become properly informed before entering shark infested waters is a personal choice and decision. The sharks are not actually responsible for warning their unsuspecting prey.........

CAVEAT EMPTOR -- Buyer Beware.

I guess it is different but in the end both apples and oranges are fruit!

I agree with what you said, I just believe if your not informed either retail or resale you will get shafted.

[Theo Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Theo]

Bill has asked me: >> My question is that of all your ownerships have all been from the developer? <<
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On the contrary, I have NEVER purchased ANY of my timeshares from a developer. All of the handful of timeshares which I own have been private purchases made on the resale market. I undertook the considerable effort to get educated and informed about timeshare early on before ever swimming in the shark infested waters of timeshare. As a result, I have no shark bite scars or depleted bank accounts and no developer has made a dime from me.

That clearly said, I also know that my parents first bought into timeshares over 25 years ago and three of their weeks were developer purchases. Two of the three, in fact, were "pre-construction" developer purchases. Although not wealthy people, they feel with conviction and certainty that they have gotten every dime's worth of value from all three of those developer -purchased weeks. They bought what they intended to use --- and did so consistently for two decades plus.

Personally, I have endured only a few "presentations". I have never accepted any free cheap luggage or hotel rooms or other enticements of minimal value to do so, so it has been with a clear conscience and a firm step that I've simply walked away in each and every instance, unashamed --- and often outright disgusted by the tactics and repeated misrepresentations of fact. I'm not advocate for developer purchases, not in any way or manner, but the educated consumer MIGHT find the right deal in the right circumstances, if he/she knows what is being purchased and exactly how they intend to use it.

[Theo Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Theo]

Re: >> I agree with what you said, I just believe if your not informed either retail or resale you will get shafted. <<
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I think it might be more accurate to say that if you're not informed, you are certainly VULNERABLE to "getting shafted". It's the personal responsibility of any consumer in any arena, timeshare included, to GET informed. Once informed, the "shaft" is then much more easily avoided.......