Tweet
Originally posted by Jya-Ning
View Post
-
The biggest problem is your last point. If the IRS performs an audit, it is the OWNER and NOT Dr. KEN who will be accountable for the late fees and penalties for taking a deduction that it too high. I think what should happen is that Dr Ken should escrow the after tax deduction for 7 years in case the audit fails. He keeps the money if after 7 years there is no audit or the audit passes. -
Further details about the process.
Originally posted by Jya-Ning View Post
Thank you, Jya-Ning, for asking the questions. That's what I believe a forum is for. I'll take each point in order. This is going to be long, but in detail so anyone can understand. Please bear with it.
1. The $500 service fee is paid to the closing company and held by the closing company until the closing company says the title has been transfered and the deal is closed. This is the same process as any real estate transaction.
2. Yes. The donor pays all closing costs and pays them to the closing company. That closing company is one the donor has checked out and selected on their own, not the NPO.
3. As in all donations of any kind, a receipt is made out to the donor which says essentially three things. A.) thank you for the donation; B.) states whether there was any part of the donation that was considered part of a purchase like a $50 dinner charge at a $500 fund raising rally; and C.) what valuation the NPO places on the donation. At that point it is out of the hands of the NPO as to what and when the donor claims the deduction. Generally the donor claims it as a deduction against this year's income and receives a tax credit based on their income tax bracket. In some instances, the amount of donation that can be taken in a particular year is limited for different reasons, not associated with the donation, and the donor can take the donation credit taken over successive years. An accountant should really explain this part. The key is that if you donate a TS this year, you will probably get an increased tax credit as soon as you file your return at the end of the year.
4. This question seems most puzzling to many NPOs, posters here and many donors. The IRS is clear in stating that if a donation is accepted by an NPO and then transferred to another within 36 months, the amount of the transfer "sale" actual cash that changes hands must be reported to the IRS on a Form 8282 - Donee Information Return.
This needs some explaining so bear with me, please. Regardless of how the NPO handles the TS, as a double closing, authorized agent, conversion, etc. it is still considered a cash transaction as soon as cash or similar goods (stocks, bonds, note abatement, etc.) or the promise of such is given. So a contract to purchase after the 36 months, if signed within the 36 months can be held as the same thing. Now, every NPO I've been able to find and research dealing with TSs actually receives their income from the resell of the TS at or soon after the donation acceptance actually takes place - either quickly if a buyer is in hand or longer if a buyer has to be found and it depends heavily on the price. In that case, the donor is limited to the amount of cash received by the NPO. If a $20,000 TS is sold for a quick sale of $2,000, the donor can only claim a $2,000 deduction. In a 25% tax bracket, that's worth $500 in a tax return. The donor is NOT able to claim $5,000 regardless of what the NPO gave as credit because the NPO is required to keep records and submit the above mentioned Form 8282. On the other hand, if the NPO takes and retains title to the TS for 36+ months, the submission of Form 8282 is no longer an issue, not required and what the donor claimed is not subject to the reduction in donation credit based on that process.
This doesn't mean the donor should claim the $20,000. It means that so long as the NPO retains it for 36 months, a legitimate higher value can be claimed if it can be justified. In this situation, the donor has the choice of claiming up to the $5,000 with minimal risk, but, also, has the opportunity to have an appraiser give a valuation higher if it is warranted. Again, on that $20,000 TS, it would be more likely that an appraiser would give a $10,000 appraisal (let's not argue this point here, just accept it as an example). One of the things the appraiser must do is consider as many actual sales, not listings, he can document. That documentation requires the names of all parties, the actual price paid, whether financing was included, and even requires the county recorders book and page number of the deed. He can't arbitrarily pull numbers out of the air, claim a lower value based on secondary market or do his shopping on the Internet. Appraisal are done by licensed people in the locale of the TS. One of the things we provide to the donor is a list of our research on sales for them to begin with. Since the only records we can access is either by Internet, mail or phone we generally have to rely on what the county recorder will tell us verbally because the required documents are NOT usually available on the Internet to read, only the title, parties and transaction type. We, also, rely on what the resort tells us. Given that process, the valuation we give is generally higher than what similar listings are claiming on TS resell sites or what the $5,000 ceiling is. In the above $20,000 example we may find that the valuation we give is $16,000 based on our research. At the time we give this to the donor (before they actually decide to donate or not and before they pay any money) it is solely up to the donor what they claim as a deduction. However, in this case and after discussing it with a local appraiser by phone, the donor may decide it would be worth the cost of an appraisal to be able to claim a much higher credit, say $12,000 which the appraiser felt he could justify. In this case, the 25% tax bracket would return $3,000 instead of the original $500. Even if the donor wanted to donate the money to the NPO, they would now have the cash to do it. Let's look at the numbers. $500 tax return, $2,000 paid by the buyer - $400 in closing costs and commissions = $1,600 to the NPO. $3,000 - $500 fee and - $300 closing costs (no commissions) = $2,200. Which is better?
The key to this is the NPO MUST retain title for 36 months. Other than the one I work with, I've found no other NPO that does.
SECOND SERIES OF QUESTIONS
1. The closing is when the closing company says it is done and only then is the NPO paid their fee.
2. Explained above. As for protection, the IRS is the one that grants NPOs the right to receive and receipt for donations. It is your tax returns that you submit. There is no association with the donation credit after it is given unless the TS is transfered for less than the original credit given. At that time the NPO is required to notify both the donor and IRS of those differences. The only possible real problem would be the closure of the NPO and liquidation of all it's assets or the required sale of assets due to dire business reasons. In both those cases, the IRS looks to the NPO to justify their action and submit the Form 8282 as required. Can anyone guarantee a business won't fail? Not that I know of. However, if a business is doing well in it's designed activities it generally continues. That's you factor of trust.
3. First of all, I'm not an accountant, nor tax attorney. This is based on my limited research and understanding. If the IRS comes to audit, their recourse is to check first if the TS was sold within the 36 months and if you were notified or not. If you were, it's your responsibility to either make up the difference in back taxes or convince the IRS that you entered into a good faith transaction, well stated from the beginning and relied on that. Downloading copies of the web site can do a lot to protect you. They would then go back to examine the current status of the NPO and why the TS was sold. If it meets with the accepted reasons and actions, there would probably be no penalty to you. If you were not notified, or if the NPO failed in their actions, you are not at fault. One last point. If a client follows our advice and gets the appraisal, it's the appraisal that protects the donor the best. Even if the NPO sells it for less within the 36 months, it would be easy to defend the appraisal and state the NPO sale was a forced sale at less than expected value established by the appraisal.
As to "my" tax value superior to the IRS. NO, I use their tax valuation system. We counsel all our clients to do the same. We back up what we say with research we've done according to IRS guidelines and still have to leave it to the donor to determine how honest and how much they want to claim. Anything more than the $5,000 requires an appraisal. Anything up to that $5,000, according to the IRS is generally accepted at face value and not audited unless the TS actually sold for less within the 36 months.
A few final notes. I don't know if the comments regarding negativity toward TSs was directed at me or someone else. I want to state that I'm not negative toward TSs. I've owned two and enjoyed them. What I am negative about is the predicament new buyers are placed into when they are herded through the normal resort sales process. I agree with several people here. They are good so long as a buyer knows what they are getting into and understands how best to deal with them.
As for BocaBum, the Truth Enforcer, I don't know you so we are on the same basis. Why should I trust your comments any better than you trust mine? Like me, your an unknown with no credentials and not willing to give us your name. You may be known by some people here, but in circles I frequent, you're a non-entity. It shouldn't give you the right nor excuse to flame people you disagree with. That's what questions are for - to gain understanding. I would like to say that if you are still working, I know at least 50 different major employers who I could talk into hiring you at a good 6 figure income if you're interested. Especially if you're willing to work for nothing for seven years and not expect anything other than your paycheck beginning 7 years from now, but only if they have everything for their business work out for them they way they plan, not the way you plan.
I'm sorry, but, if you can't see the difference between a normal NPO and what we do and charge for, I'm really at a loss how to explain it. Let's see if I can state it a little better. the normal NPO takes a TS sells it and keeps ALL the cash but gives some donation credit to the donor. If they sold it for $1,000 it is still sold and the donor gets nothing except a tax refund of $250 if they're in a 25% tax bracket. Whereas, if the donor did the same thing and went to the same broker for a quick sale, they would pay closing costs, commission and expenses of maybe $500 and walk away with $500 in their pocket but no donation credit and no $250 tax refund. On the other hand, through CHT, the donor pays the fee, which is the only source of income from the transaction to the NPO, pays the other expenses for, let's say $800 but gets a higher $5,000 income deduction and a bigger $1,250 tax return with a net of $450 in their pocket. Maybe you can explain it better than I can but I see them as essentially the same thing in the end, The donor gets out of the TS, the donor gets a tax deduction, the NPO gets money and all fees are paid. The cash difference to the donor was $250 by donating to the normal NPO, $500 by selling it on his own and $450 if donating it to CHT. Considering the time involved, delays before a buyer is found and the hassle of the process, which is best? The real payer in both donations is the IRS.
Jya-Ning I hope I've been able to explain things to your understanding. Yes there always has to be some point of trust, but we've tried to limit it to as little as possible.
Dr. Ken Rich
Comment
-
Dr Ken,
That was a long post with a lot of factual information in it and a whole lot of fuzzy logic. You basically say that you have an NPO that will hold a timeshare donation for 3 years before they dispose of it. That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Why would such an organization do that? It would cost them several thousand dollars in holding costs just so others could take a tax deduction without a lower amount being reported? I am highly suspect of schemes that don't make any financial sense. Usually, if something is too good to be true, it probably is.
There is a person who I hold in high esteem. His name is Dave M. He is a CPA and one of the timesharing world's most knowledgable people on Marriott's. His prior professional advice is that you cannot take the higher deduction that you are suggesting that the taxpayer take. If you are going to take that type of risk, why not just take a huge deduction and just hope you don't get audited? At the end of the day, the donor needs to justify their method of valuation to the IRS if they get audited. I would trust Dave M's free advice over your $500 advice any day of the week.
I find it interesting that you admit you are not a tax expert and yet you offer a service attempting to help owners reduce their taxes. By the way, they get a tax deduction for a donation, not a tax credit. There is a big difference. Perhaps you should look it up.
Keep posting. The more you post, the more you will either prove or disprove your value to readers on this message board. I've already proven my value. You have a ways to go.Comment
-
Let me see if my understanding is correct, since I am not CPA, so I will for now assume you did check the IRS part to cover what you say. I will try to figure out if it is true or false if I really need to refer you to someone or use myself.Originally posted by drkenrich
1. $500 is your income
2. you will use the NPO and put it on the line
3. if you hold it for 36 month, then we may claim higher value if we dare, and refile adjustment (means do a 1040X)
4. if for some reason you sold it within 36 month, we will claim that amount and probably refile the adjustment.
Sounds interesting.
As Boca says, if I suddenly become need, I will probably looking for Dave M for his idea on this, and proably need to see the prove of your NPO status based on his suggestion.
Since you stepped into this forum, as long as you are not trying to use it as your free advertisement, welcome. Hopefully, we will see your post in the future and know each other more.
Jya-NingJya-NingComment
-
Dr. Ken,
Is this stock advisory service yours?
IHL Stock Advisory
Why should anyone trust a person who claims that to have a scheme to gain 20% per year without risking any money through a program subsidized by the US Government and secured by real estate?
Is this the other half of your scam?Comment
-
Hey, that site says 703 % a year !!! Do you get a free bottle of snake oil with that ?Comment
-
Tax advise
If anyone wants tax advise for timeshares, I would check this link.
If people would buy timeshares for use mainly and not so much for exchanging all over the world, people would be happier with their purchase even if they paid too much. Anyone buying from a developer is paying way too much but when they tell you that you can travel all over the world, then it is becoming a big disappointment when you find out that it is very hard to do.
Why so much deception in this industry? I am so glad there are timeshare forums to educate the people but it would be better if we could educate everyone before they buy rather than after they have bought.
Comment
-
Let's ask Dave M to weigh in on this. Okay?
A simple answer to both of you. I would take a CPA's advice as well. If I knew Dave M and his credentials, I would listen to him as well. However, I have found CPAs in error on matters in the past so I always try to do my own research. And again I ask, "Who is this BocaBum?"
I don't ask you to believe me. I answer questions you raise and ask you to check out the sources yourself. If you need a list of IRS publications I can furnish them. I'd rather let you read them yourself and draw your own conclusions instead of argue each point here with you. In fact, why don't you ask Dave M to read what I've written and tell me himself what's wrong with it? I would appreciate his input. Again, we don't ever advise a client to take a bigger deduction than they can legally justify. We tell them and make it clear that if they want to take more than the $5,000 ceiling, they need to get a licensed appraiser. We just try to help them maximize their valuation to the best point they legally can. How many other NPOs automatically give $4,900 to $5,000 in donation credit without any research and knowingly sell it for far less without notifying the IRS and donor that the claimed deduction they told the donor to take must be amended downward? Is that honest, fair or legal? Go back and read the instructions to Form 8282. That's the IRS talking, people, not little ol' me.
For those that may not know, a tax deduction and tax credit are often used interchangeably in conversation and discussions without going into the detail of their differences. That is not always a good idea. It assumes the listener understands the difference already. But it does happen. However, they are very different. A tax deduction is what a taxpayer subtracts from their gross income to arrive at an amount that is taxable. A tax credit is a deduction from the actual tax charge. If a $1,000 tax deduction is taken from a taxpayer in a 25% tax bracket his total income is reduced by $1,000 and he receives a reduction in tax of $250 which is the tax credit.
Is what the NPO offers too good to be true? I don't think so. Especially since I know and understand their position regarding ownership of timeshares. They are in a slightly different position than a normal owner and the normal consequences and actions of resort actions to collect their ongoing fees have very different outcomes.
A normal owner doesn't pay his fees. The resort threatens then sends the owner to collection, begins harassing phone calls, dings the owner's credit, and eventually can take the matter to court, get a judgment and levy a lien against other things the owner owns if the resultant return of the TS doesn't cover the outstanding debt. That's quite a powerful influence to keep owners paying and NOT taking the timeshare back as 1950bing and a lot of other owners experienced.
Now in a normal corporation there are owners of the corporation called shareholders who can sometimes hide behind their corporate vale and sometimes not. The thing most people want a corporation for is to be able to prevent lawsuits from taking their personal property away from them. This usually works. The difference is that with an NPO, there is no stock and therefore no owners to go after. Another big difference is that if a normal corporation loses in court and is forced to dissolve, the assets of the corporation revert to the individuals and the claims. An NPO, however, when disbanded has all assets revert to the government entity in which it is established (difference between states here but think of it as all the TSs going to the state). Now, if the resort follows their legal course of actions they have used for years to pressure people to continue in bad financial circumstances without any consideration (only the bad guys, not the good resorts) it just plain doesn't do any good against an NPO. The worst that can be done is file a negative report, not with the three big credit bureaus, but with Dunn and Bradstreet, since it's a business not an individual. Not all of them belong or wish to go to that effort for a lost cause anyway.
CHT doesn't use credit. They are not worried about the harassing phone calls, credit dings, if a resort wants to force a court battle where the end result is reversion of the TS back to the resort, they are willing to let that happen. If that happens within the 36 months, that is not a consequence for the donor, it is a legal forced transaction and donors don't have to worry about an audit. However, at the end of the 36 months, if the resort has been willing to wait without much complaint, they can have the TS deeded back to them with no problem. The NPO takes the brunt of the threats and potential consequences for the donor, the resort gets no payment for three years and in the end, it's all over. It's not illegal, it is breach of contract, and it is a service to the donor for that delayed action and release. I still think it's worth the paltry $500 they get out of it for all that hassle.
I realize it isn't explained in this much detail on the website and frankly it's not necessary to go into all that for the donor. However, if you bothered to read the web site you would find that it is somewhat covered there. Let me quote part of page two for you:
Why can you accept the timeshares?
We have been specially set up and designed to do so. We do not face the same risks of collection other organizations do. We do NOT resell the timeshares.
Like some of you and 1950bing, I firmly believe it would be in the best interest to have resorts create a resale program for owners who want out. I believe they could make money with them by either accepting them at no or little payment to the owner, since that is what the owner expects anyway. It's against the ones that don't that I rile at and who I work against. But if you don't like the idea of a resort not getting paid for 3 years and getting a TS given back to them, I guess we should all just continue with the old system of ruining the credit of those poor people that can't use or afford their TS any more. If you think this is somehow illegal, I don't want to hear a plain opinion. Do me and everyone else here the courtesy, and present yourself with some referenced backing, by defining which law is being broken and what consequences there are for breaking it. Until then I believe that anything else is simply crass opinion with no bearing in fact.
I realize my answers are long, but with the slings and arrows of quick, undocumented jabs, it's necessary to take the space and time to explain things in detail.Thank you for the opportunity to help you see the light. I would appreciate they same response from those who disagree. Please give us something to analyze and understand other than simple opinion. Tell me what research has lead you to your opinion and what it's founded on. That's the way a quality forum should operate, based on documented facts. Until then, I recognize opinion is only worth the paper it's written on and this is the electronic age.
Dr. Ken RichComment
-
Dr. Ken,
I don't know you and I cannot judge you either because I don't know you.
However, I have met Boca Bum and know his real name and I trust him 100%. He is a very smart person and has experience in buying and selling timeshares at a little profit each time (I hope) and knows how to use them and enjoy them with his family. He has helped many of us and he has shared his knowledge with us freely as long as he has been on the forum here. All I can suggest to you is read his posts. As far as Dave M is concerned, he also knows what he is talking about and his advise helps all of us a lot too. I gave you the link. He is very knowledgeable about the Marriott resorts because that's what he owns and likes.
I know one thing and that is that you cannot fool the IRS because if you get caught, you end up paying a lot more than if you had paid up in the first place. If you know that you defraud them and they can prove it, you may end up in jail. No timeshare is worth that problem. Get rid of it and take your loss and forget about it or enjoy it and make the best of it while you own it.Comment
-
Don't you recognize my picture? You can call me KING......Originally posted by drkenrich
King Kamehameha that is.
None of your verbose responses will take away my opinion that you are a fraud and providing unsound tax advice.
The bottom line of what you are recommending is setting up a scenario where the tax payer can claim a deduction so much higher than he can actually sell it for that donating the timeshare using your scheme yields at least $500 more than selling it outright so that YOU can get paid.
At the end of the day, that is tax fraud. You can call it what you want. But, the definition of Fair Market Value is what you can sell it for in on open market in an arms length transaction. All you are doing is creating a scenario that slightly reduces the tax payers ability to get caught by the IRS.Comment
-
As Boca pointed out, there is a difference between a tax deduction and a tax credit. This is twice (at least) you have done this. I assume you probably mean well (and probably mean tax deduction) but since "tax credit" is a very specific term (a $1 credit means $1 reduction of your tax bill regardless of income) you need to be very careful in your usage.Originally posted by drkenrich
Here you have really stepped into deep doo doo.Originally posted by drkenrich
There are 3440 members on this board. About 1900 of those have never posted and probably don't know who BocaBum is. I would wager the remaining 1550 or so know him. In fact, he has given his name in multiple posts. He has NOTHING to hide. If you would do some research before flaming him you might have known that. He has established his credibility. Many times over. You are not on the same basis. You have yet to establish your credibility. Making factual errors and dissembling do not aid in that process.
Comment
-
Hey Dr. Ken,
Since you are selling tax evasion schemes, here is an idea for you. It will be a lot easier to administer than taking timeshares off people's hands and you can get repeat customers every year instead of just one time. It would save you lots of money in sales expense and your customers don't have to wait 3 years hoping that your NPO holds the timeshare.
Since you have a non-profit, why don't you sell $4000 tax receipts for $500 each. The receipt includes all kinds of junk that would normally be sold in a garage sale and can be itemized via turbo tax Itsdeductible. If your customer is in the 35% bracket, then they would be saving $1400.Comment
-
Vale (vāl) n. A valley, often coursed by a stream; a dale.Originally posted by drkenrich
Veil (vāl) n. something that covers, separates, screens, or conceals.
You just keep digging deeper & deeper. I am sure your spell check said everything was copacetic but that doesn't really mean anything.
But more than your gross abuses of the English language (which undermines your professional credibility) is the practices of the NPO you work with/for.
This MAY not be illegal. I can't speak to that. It IS immoral. I hope nobody who owns at Cottages at Shipyard EVER uses your services. My MF will go up if they do.Originally posted by drkenrichComment
-
Let me introduce my self to you Dr Rich. We both are in similar type professions.
I am almost a highly paid tacks sort of self professed non expert like you. Do you also shear sheep?
I met the so called Boca Bum about 41.6865340538745787 months ago in West Palm Beach, and you are right that is not his real name. I am glad you called him on that false name he uses as his real name I have heard is Chief Surgeon Bum Boca.
I think maybe he out ranks you as
you are not even a regular surgeon.
No on second though after judging the difference in the content in your and his posts you have everybody out ranked due to the content of your posts. Are you a farmer that specializes and raises fertilizer by any chance?
I am the most Holy Reverend Doctor Bruce of the Holy Church of the Snowmobile Trail and 6th Wednesday Of The Month
Polka Party Church.
If all of you sinners out there each send me just $500 a month for only 360 months I will pray for your soul does not descend into hell and after 1,000 years come back reincarnated as a timeshare sales man or a timeshare tax consultant. Supply is limited, so if you snooze
you lose and get burned.
We also have a sure fire business big money opportunity for you and in this profession it helps to be a sure shot. Please send $500 for our information packet and I will be glad you did. You can pay us buy using Paypal but then add 3% to pay the Paypal’s extra fees.
We also for just a measly $500 per month send you a bottle of our secret formula Love poison number 69. It is a
killer of a deal. Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose
We have all kinds of almost semi legal get rich in 34.567 hours business opportunities that you can secure for only $500 down and only 54 years of monthly payments of only $500 per month.
We do have a approved list of Bail Bondsmen to help you over some business problems that can occur.
Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose If after only 50 years you do not to continue you will not have to pay for those last four years. No need to thank us for being so generous in trying to help our fellow man.
Sorry, no personal checks accepted as I have to be careful as there really are some scammers out there who will bounce their checks after getting the benefit from my fail proof money making programs.
We do have a special information guide on were to pick up slightly used government $100 bill printing press. Just send $500 to us and we will surely make someone rich and happy. Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose.
UNSincerely,
Brucecz
The Rushes Door Co., wk 35. Desert Club Las Vegas RCI Pts. 1 UDI Cottage CMV UDI's & 7 Oak Timbers CMV UDI's with 30,000 Bluegreen Pts. 3 World Wide Vacation Club Lind Mar Puerto Vallarta. Fox Hills RCI Pts More of our Timeshare Ownerships.Comment
-
Great!!
Totally worth my time in visiting for a few minutes. Funniest post in years, Bruce!!
Originally posted by brucecz View PostLet me introduce my self to you Dr Rich. We both are in similar type professions.
I am almost a highly paid tacks sorts self professed non expert like you. Do you also shear sheep?
I met the so called Boca Bum about 41.6865340538745787 months ago in West Palm Beach, and you are right that is not his real name. I am glad you called him on that false name he uses as his real name I have heard is Chief Surgeon Bum Boca.
I think maybe he out ranks you asyou are not even a regular surgeon.
No on second though after judging the difference in the content in your and his posts you have everybody out ranked due to the content of your posts. Are you a farmer that specializes and raises fertilizer by any chance?
I am the most Holy Reverend Doctor Bruce of the Holy Church of the Snowmobile Trail and 6th Wednesday Of The Month Polka Party Church.
If all of you sinners out there each send me just $500 a month for only 360 months I will pray for your soul does not descend into hell and after 1,000 years come back reincarnated as a timeshare sales man or a timeshare tax consultant. Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose and get burned.
We also have a sure fire business big money opportunity for you and in this profession it helps to be a sure shot. Please send $500 for our information packet and I will be glad you did. You can pay us buy using Paypal but then add 3% to pay the Paypal’s extra fees.
We also for just a measly $500 per month send you a bottle of our secret formula Love poison number 69. It is a killer of a deal. Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose
We have all kinds of almost semi legal get rich in 34.567 hours business opportunities that you can secure for only $500 down and only 54 years of monthly payments of only $500 per month.
We do have a approved list of Bail Bondsmen to help you over some business problems that can occur.
Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose If after only 50 years you do not to continue you will not have to pay for those last four years. No need to thank us for being so generous in trying to help our fellow man.
Sorry, no personal checks accepted as I have to be careful as there really are some scammers out there who will bounce their checks after getting the benefit from my fail proof money making programs.
We do have a special information guide on were to pick up slightly used government $100 bill printing press. Just send $500 to us and we will surely make someone rich and happy. Supply is limited, so if you snooze you lose.
UNSincerely,
BruceczM. HenleyComment
Comment