Some thoughts and some questions about Bluegreen aka rant

[stevec Member Find all posts View Profile Close stevec]

We originally bought at Oasis Lakes which was owned by Airtours a UK based travel company (Now renamed the Fountains )
We only purchased one week.
When Bluegreen bought the place off Airtours we had a meeting with a sales guy who said that they were trying to get people with fixed weeks to convert to points.
All we needed to do was buy some.
This was supposedly better for all concerned but tbh it was better for Bluegreen in reality.
Anyway we were told all the rubbish (aka trash) about getting 2 free weeks for the next 3 years.
They turned out to be RCI weeks which aint free in anyone’s book.
He told us that we would have enough points for 2 weeks every year which turned out only to be true if we converted them to RCI points.
We have now been owners for over 10 years and eventually succumbed to the sales pitch and bought enough points to give us 2 weeks a year which we bough at a supposedly favourable rate (when is it not ? )
So we are now silver members whoopee !
At our last owner update (thinly disguised sales pitch) it was suggested that we upgrade to Gold membership and on doing so would not have to pay anymore maintenance fees !
Is this true ? From what I have read here it don’t seem so.
There is no denying that the Fountains and other Bluegreen resorts are quality and we have had many happy vacations.
But here is the rub I don’t feel like I am getting a good deal at the present time.
We used our points this year towards part payment for a cruise we didn’t get a bad deal but tbh I could have got a slightly better one as a free agent.
Its also the same with the Fountains If I just went through a travel agent I could have got 2 weeks for less than my maintenance fee !
Some of the info posted here is either downright wrong or needs updating.
Selling points back to Bluegreen to pay club dues maintenance fees etc is a very bad idea since they stomped on their value. It was nice while it lasted.
IT seem like owners have little control over anything.
Oh the sales guy also said bonus time prices were fixed for life it seems that is BS too.
Does anyone have any info on the trading back your points to Bluegreen for real estate ? or is that just another white lie .
I am not looking to sell as I paid a lot but I feel I am making the best of a bad deal.
As for RCI (blood sucking leeches ) I put some points in their space bank thought I would have a few days in New York in October there is a nice place called the Manhattan club some nice pictures on their website when I rang up to book operator said its never available its only on the website because they get some sort of discount they either use the time themselves or gift it to relatives.
Also the reason I ended up using points for a cruise was the fact that when I checked with RCI for places during peak holiday times there was little to nothing available.
Having spoken to other owners it seems that unless you either own or want to go off season to a popular resort there is hardly any chance of getting in.
It don’t look like I will be using RCI much if ever.
My apologies if this is hard to read I have no literary skills ,grammar, punctuation etc and it was hard to type using 1 finger

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

Hi Steve,

Sorry to hear of your issues. It's not uncommon for owners to feel the way you do. The first thing we need to do is to help you understand the truth about how the BVC works. I believe the lionshare of problems occur because new owners have the wrong expectations for how the Club actually works (vs. how they were led or misled to believe).

I'll start by addressing two of your questions. First, it is NOT true that you will be maintenance free if you are Silver or Gold. The exchange rate for paying your maintenance fees with points is very bad. It's about $.01/point. It used to be $.05/point. When it was that rate, it was a great deal. Now, not so much.

Regarding trading points for land, that is a real program. Not sure if it is a good deal as I have not done it myself. However, there is reason to believe that it is a pretty good value. That's because Bluegreen is saddled with a residential real estate division that is holding a bunch of land that it wants to get rid of. Bluegreen seems to believe that it can sell Vacation Club points more easily than land in this market. So, they will give you equity value for your points for land. You do need to pay a minimum amount. And, you can check the value of the land prior to offering an equity trade in. So, technically, it's possible to get your equity out if you can use or sell the land (big if). This program will likely only be good for as long as Bluegreen has land for sale. When they are out of land, I highly doubt they will continue offering it.

As far as your other questions. You should probably ask one or two per post so it's easier for other owners to answer your questions. However, just keep posting questions to this thread until you have all of your questions answered. You will find a lot of owners jumping in to help. And, when you have a good understanding of the policies of the Club, you are much more likely to be happy with your ownership.

Welcome and good posting,

[smithiekid Member Find all posts View Profile Close smithiekid]

Steve,
we were also owners at Oasis lakes and back in 2004 we also bought into the BGVC, we did not sell our unit back to BG untill the following year. The first year we used the AIM prog and went to MB in a 1 bed for 2 weeks , this used around the same points as 1 week at Oasis Lakes. It was in MB that we sold our week back to BG bought a few more points and ended up with 24000, since then we have bought 12000 to get us to gold from pinnacle. We are now in the process of completing on 21000 more pts bought for peanuts off e bay having worked out Plat membership would give Uk owners very few benefits over gold.
looking back to that first meeting with BG we seemed to have droped lucky , we were never lied to and everything was explained in crystal clear detail, dont get me wrong I have lots of run ins with BG in the early days and I dont stand for any nonsance now any problems and they are given 1 chance to sort it then its straight onto the resort General Manager, but I have to say that it is always sorted ( may be its got dont mess with him flagged on our account lol)
I agree that RCI is a joke in the UK and as much use as a choc firegard, each time we have tried to use them the availability is very limited, we did get a good deal with 1 of our free BG weeks we got a 2 bed in Orlando in Jan but never ever anything in the UK for spring bank week no matter how soon you deposit.
I still have to sort out RCI points thro travellers plus after a dozen or so emails I do have a number to phone but not got round to it yet.
We always have been able to use all our points so RCI has not come into it very much, I am thinking of using 1 of the other exchange companies
Have you used Select connections yet? we used it for Vino Bello in Napa and peacok suties in LA this year. It would be nice if the extend SC with a european/UK timeshare.
As Jim says ask questions on here also join Bluegreen group on Yahoo

Phillip

[stevec Member Find all posts View Profile Close stevec]

The only way to avoid paying maintenance it seems

Fountains Resort Orlando Florida, Edited link BF

All the benefits and no yearly ever increasing maintenance fee !
Anyone else feel like they are subsidising non owners ?
The prices do compare favourably with my annual maintenance and there are special deals
And yes I did notice that it is not every month of the year.
Thanks for the replies the shell resorts seem worth a look in the future.
Oh and what is BVC ?

[crwisconsin Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close crwisconsin]

Manhattan Club Trade

As for RCI (blood sucking leeches ) I put some points in their space bank thought I would have a few days in New York in October there is a nice place called the Manhattan club some nice pictures on their website when I rang up to book operator said its never available its only on the website because they get some sort of discount they either use the time themselves or gift it to relatives.

I do believe that I heard of people trading into the Manhattan Club but it is very rare since NYC is a prime location 100% of the time.

Charles

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

The only way to avoid paying maintenance it seems

Fountains Resort Orlando Florida Edited link BF

All the benefits and no yearly ever increasing maintenance fee !
Anyone else feel like they are subsidising non owners ?
The prices do compare favourably with my annual maintenance and there are special deals
And yes I did notice that it is not every month of the year.
Thanks for the replies the shell resorts seem worth a look in the future.
Oh and what is BVC ?

Shell Vacation Club works great. If you have Traveler Plus, use it.

Regarding rentals, it's a good thing for the Club to have rentals in the market, it keeps occupancy levels up and most of the funds go to offset maintenance fees. So, the way to look at rentals is that it helps to prevent default levels of points and results in more maintenance fees to be paid each year thereby keeping fees lower than they would otherwise be.

[smithiekid Member Find all posts View Profile Close smithiekid]

Steve,

BGVC is Bluegreen Vacation Club

[stevec Member Find all posts View Profile Close stevec]

Steve,

BGVC is Bluegreen Vacation Club

Thanks I worked it out myself just after I posted

[stevec Member Find all posts View Profile Close stevec]

Shell Vacation Club works great. If you have Traveler Plus, use it.

Regarding rentals, it's a good thing for the Club to have rentals in the market, it keeps occupancy levels up and most of the funds go to offset maintenance fees. So, the way to look at rentals is that it helps to prevent default levels of points and results in more maintenance fees to be paid each year thereby keeping fees lower than they would otherwise be.

Thanks to big frank for editing out my link
It sort of made my post pointless.
Jim its not about rentals its retail,as in anyone can visit Bluegreen resorts by booking through a travel agent at favourable prices.
Prior to the recession I could compare these prices and found that I was getting a good deal.
With the economy the way it is BG does not need to give me any special deal because I have to pay every year.
Of course they use it as an opportunity to sell timeshare and damn them sales guys are good.
When things pick up maybe it will swing back in my favour.

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

Thanks to big frank for editing out my link
It sort of made my post pointless.
Jim its not about rentals its retail,as in anyone can visit Bluegreen resorts by booking through a travel agent at favourable prices.
Prior to the recession I could compare these prices and found that I was getting a good deal.
With the economy the way it is BG does not need to give me any special deal because I have to pay every year.
Of course they use it as an opportunity to sell timeshare and damn them sales guys are good.
When things pick up maybe it will swing back in my favour.

The prices go up and down based on the economy. Right now, BG is renting The Fountains at $144/night. I just checked for Nov. At, $144 for 7 nights, that is $1008 for 13000 points = $.0775/point. That more than covers maintenance fees. When that is rented, that is money that goes to reduce the Fountains MF as it is a contra expense to the budget.

When the market is stronger, the Fountains rents for well over $200 retail. We still only get MF. But, again, that is a reduced amount to all owners.

[stevec Member Find all posts View Profile Close stevec]

The prices go up and down based on the economy. Right now, BG is renting The Fountains at $144/night. I just checked for Nov. At, $144 for 7 nights, that is $1008 for 13000 points = $.0775/point. That more than covers maintenance fees. When that is rented, that is money that goes to reduce the Fountains MF as it is a contra expense to the budget.

When the market is stronger, the Fountains rents for well over $200 retail. We still only get MF. But, again, that is a reduced amount to all owners.

You did agree with me in a roundabout way
You say that all other income helps reduce or keep down maintenance fees ?
It doesn’t go to pay shareholders ? Profits etc
Debt/Equity Ratio2.68Gross Margin61.98%Net Profit Margin-0.65%Total Shares Outstanding32.5 MilMarket Capitalization108.57 MilEarnings/Share-0.56
I guess they are helping keep the group solvent at the moment.
Here’s a question if BGC went bust would we as owners get anything when the property we supposedly own gets sold ?

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

You did agree with me in a roundabout way
You say that all other income helps reduce or keep down maintenance fees ?
It doesn’t go to pay shareholders ? Profits etc
Debt/Equity Ratio2.68Gross Margin61.98%Net Profit Margin-0.65%Total Shares Outstanding32.5 MilMarket Capitalization108.57 MilEarnings/Share-0.56
I guess they are helping keep the group solvent at the moment.
Here’s a question if BGC went bust would we as owners get anything when the property we supposedly own gets sold ?

Bluegreen Corporation is a publicly traded company with ticker symbol BXG. You can check out their earnings releases in the archives of this forum. When you read such release, you will see that Bluegreen makes it's profit from the sales of timeshares, loans, management of resorts and selling of residential real estate.

The Bluegreen Vacation Club is a separate corporation set up as a Trust where OWNERS such as you and me own the properties. If BXG went bankrupt and was liquidated, the BVC would remain and another company would take over to manage it for a fee. As long as owners keep paying maintenance fees, the Bluegreen Vacation Club will continue whether or not BXG exists.

Revenue from rentals of Club inventory goes to the Trust which belongs to owners.

[stevec Member Find all posts View Profile Close stevec]

As long as owners keep paying maintenance fees, the Bluegreen Vacation Club will continue whether or not BXG exists.

Revenue from rentals of Club inventory goes to the Trust which belongs to owners.

Thanks Jim
This is good news

[Fsmith Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Fsmith]

Jim, could we change management companies now?

[crwisconsin Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close crwisconsin]

No Management Change

Jim, could we change management companies now?

Technically Yes, Practically No. Owners of Owner Beneficiary Rights are Class A members. The Developer is a Class B Member. According to Part III. 2. A. of the Multi-Site Public Offering Statement, "The Class B Member is entitled to two (2) times the number of votes of the Class A Members at all times."

Charles