Some general questions

[1950bing Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 1950bing]

Well, you are with a bunch people that you do not want to interact with
( your words .) What's the difference in being around a B & B table and around the people asigned to your table on a ship? Also, on a cruise there is all kinds of stuff planned for you to do which is one of your complaints about B & B. ( " forced to go to " )
If you are not sure about bathrooms ava., @ a B & B, go on the net and see what is ava. or call them up and ask.. If they don't have what you want then try the next one, no big deal. Having a private bath is one of my requirements too. Rember, when using a bathroom that is open to the public you are sharing the space with them but they are not in there with you. Trust me,your are sharing.

Timesharing done right is good. It's the people who are done wrong that is my focus. There are a lot of owners that wish they had never taken the tour and a lot who have them paying year after year and not using them with NO idea of how to get rid of them. The resort is of no help. All they want is the money. They are usually the living spouse and know no better than to pay each year. It's sad.

[BoardGirl Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BoardGirl]

OK, I see what you're saying. Thank you for the clarity.

On my last cruise, several nights we had a table for two, several lunches we had in the buffet area, and we did room service. Not forced to dine with anyone. Anytime Dining also means 'anywhere with anyone'.

Activities are there, but so many people, there is no coercion. Not the same as being in the kitchen with 3 other couples and having pressure applied to go on the hike, or whatever. "Oh c'mon, the rest of us are going, it will be fun! Don't be a party-pooper!"

I like to explore ports, not hang out on the ship doing stuff I could do at home.

There's one other thing that makes us a bad fit for B&B - hubby has a night job so will normally sleep until noon or 2. Ain't no way everyone in the house is gonna be quiet that long. Easy to do in a private condo, tho. Foolish to buy B & B and miss out on one of the Bs.

Yes, there are some people that fall prey to sales hype. Perhaps it's uncaring of me to say it this way, but Buyer Beware - it's their own fault for not researching a major purchase. Someone else's financial difficulties that arise out of an unwise purchase are not going to negatively impact my vacation. I look forward to my trips for well over a year. Maybe BBs can be booked that far in advance, I don't know. Honestly, I've never looked into it very far.

But you are correct that there are some very sleazy sales people out there. We can definitely agree on that.

[ladycody Member Find all posts View Profile Close ladycody]

I do own my own home because I know someday I will sell it for a very nice profit!

There's no gaurantee...there are a ton of people who bought homes in the last 10 years that are currently hard pressed to sell for what they paid...much less make enough to break even with the interest paid out on it.

Also, I would never own a home that had owner's dues. I see that as wasted money. I fund all my repairs and improvements.

You do in fact own a home that has owner's dues....and you're naive to think otherwise. You pay property taxes, electricity, water, trash, phone, heat, repairs&replacements, and any services that you have provided (lawn, newpaper, pool, etc)...and your expenses are increasing every year as well (unless you live somewhere where utilities, taxes, labor and merchandise costs are decreasing).

So lets look at my (theoretical) first 10 years of owning a TS...
if I financed it over 10 years at developer rates (which I didnt).
$40,000 (including interest) developer costs of purchase
$7,500 dues over 10 years guestimate
$8,000 some exchanges or extra BT/last call vacations
$55,500 Total

I average 30 nights per year in 2br condos or better...and my average price per night would be : 55,500/10/30 = $185 per night (and it would be lower if I could travel more.) At first blush may seem high...but then remember I'm in a 2br condo in a beautiful resort...most hotels in tourist areas are getting darn close to the same amount...and am spending about $400 per week less on food for my family of 4 than I would if I were staying in hotels.

Now lets look at my next (theoretical) 10 years...my TS is paid for now:

$10,000 total dues (figuring in some inflation)
$12,000 exchanges + last call and BT (with some inflation added in)
$22,000 Total

Assume I continue to average 30 nights per year and continue to stay in 2br condos ...then 22,000/10/30=$73 per night and I'm still saving on food costs.

So...at developer prices (and paying full boat on interest) over all 20 years, my average room cost is $129 per night for 2br condo stays:$77,500/20(years)/30(nites per year)=$129....not a bad value when you consider property amenities, locations, and the fact that the Best Western gets at least that in tourist areas right now for a hotel room...never mind what they'll be charging 20 years from now.

Oh yeah...How much have I saved on food costs? (and we wont bother figuring in inflation...but you and I both know it's there):

Average is 4 weeks (I'll give ya the 2 days) per year X 20 years = 80 weeks
I said I saved about $400 per week by utilizing my kitchen...so....
80*$400=$32,000 That's $32,000 that I either saved or spent on fun stuff with my family doing things I otherwise wouldnt have had the money to do.

Now...the reality is that my costs are well below thpse shown above because I didnt pay all that interest...and I personally consider my purchase price a write-off ...rather like buying a really nice car that wouldnt ever need to be replaced. If they made such a vehicle I'd buy one. You'd still have to put gas in it...at ever increasing prices...and make an occassional repair...but it would sure beat the heck out of buying a new one every 5-10 years!!!

Now...if you dont use what you own...or use it minimally...or buy one that is a sham with regard to one's ability to use it (there are a few)...then TS is likely not a smart route. For those of us who use them wisely...it cant be beat.

Timesharing done right is good. It's the people who are done wrong that is my focus.

Agreed...

K...done...that's just my 2 cents (albeit long-winded)

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

Ladycody,

Your costs would actually be even lower for 2 reasons. First, you assume your timeshare is worthless at the end of your ownership. Indeed, it will have some positive residual value when you sell it. Second, you included inflation in your costs, but you didn't discount them back to the present by a reasonable discount rate.

So, even when purchasing from the developer, it's not a bad deal if you use it every year for 10 years or more. That is the essence of their economical argument. They just dont' tell you that you can do even better if you simply buy resale.

[ladycody Member Find all posts View Profile Close ladycody]

Kinda cool...no???

I got a little overexcited in my reply and didnt eval it all out...but it still works...and actually it works even better than I stated. I got mentally electrocuted by the statement that he wouldnt own a house that had owners dues...and replied when torn between angered disbelief and laughter...but I'm over it.

All I can tell anyone is that I NOW pay out about $1000 (or slightly over) per year for an average of 30 nights per year in 2br condos...nice ones...and I'm thrilled!!!

[1950bing Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 1950bing]

You do know there are neighborhoods that DO have homeowner fees don't you?

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

Kinda cool...no???

I got a little overexcited in my reply and didnt eval it all out...but it still works...and actually it works even better than I stated. I got mentally electrocuted by the statement that he wouldnt own a house that had owners dues...and replied when torn between angered disbelief and laughter...but I'm over it.

All I can tell anyone is that I NOW pay out about $1000 (or slightly over) per year for an average of 30 nights per year in 2br condos...nice ones...and I'm thrilled!!!

To get a more accurate picture of your total costs instead of your annual costs, all you need to do is take the total cost of your capital purchase and closing costs (called your tax basis) and multiply it by a cost of capital factor. I like to use 8% because that is how much my bank would offer me an unsecured business loan for. And, since WorldMark depreciates in value over time, estimate the annual depreciation and add that to your total annual cost as well. Then, divide it by the number of nights you took. That will give you a much better apples to apples comparison with renting a week from a B&B.

So, the biggest drivers of cost are 1) amount of capital purchase, 2) annual fees, 3) how aggressive or passive you are at optimally using your system, 4) how much it depreciates over time. To maximize value, you just find the timeshares that are the best in these categories.

WorldMark and Bluegreen really do well with each of these attributes.