$5,893.32 special assessment for Diamond's Point at Poipu

[singlemalt_18 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close singlemalt_18]

...I'd much prefer the additional assessment and pay the figure up front vs being surprised after the fact, which is pretty much the way DRI is handling the situation at this time...

I do not trust DRI and wouldn't be surprised if another assessment were to follow.

If additional assessments do get levied in future years it will most likely be due to higher than planned delinquencies by owners. I'm not a DRI fan, and they have not handled this well at all. They are also not the evil villain that the "Angry" folks want to blame for this mess... they talk like DRI planned this whole thing as a conspiracy for cryin' out loud.

To your strategic point, I have also wondered if it would make more sense to just close the place down and do it all at once. Why not get the work finished completely, and re-open with the project entirely out of the way? It shouldn't take any more than a year I would think?

The drip, drip, drip, over a couple of years - no pun intended - will only pro-long this disaster.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

They are also not the evil villain that the "Angry" folks want to blame for this mess... they talk like DRI planned this whole thing as a conspiracy for cryin' out loud.[/B]

I don't have a chicken in this fight, but I have not taken it that way at all.
I have taken it that DRI monopolizes the Board(s) and stonewalls owners' attempt to organize and communicate.

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

To your strategic point, I have also wondered if it would make more sense to just close the place down and do it all at once. Why not get the work finished completely, and re-open with the project entirely out of the way? It shouldn't take any more than a year I would think?]

Probably because that would mean everybody would need to pay their entire assessment now instead of spread out over three years (or more for some owners).

It would also tremendously disrupt staffing, as the entire housekeeping and maintenance staff would be laid off during the rebuild, and they would find new work during that period.

Finally - and certainly not least for the real decision-makers at the resort - it would be difficult to conduct sales operations at a resort that is being rebuilt and that has no guests who can be routed through the sales presentation.

[dougp26364 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dougp26364]

Probably because that would mean everybody would need to pay their entire assessment now instead of spread out over three years (or more for some owners).

It would also tremendously disrupt staffing, as the entire housekeeping and maintenance staff would be laid off during the rebuild, and they would find new work during that period.

Finally - and certainly not least for the real decision-makers at the resort - it would be difficult to conduct sales operations at a resort that is being rebuilt and that has no guests who can be routed through the sales presentation.

And what about owners and their annual usage rights and the rights of trust members? I would imagine there would be an even larger outcry if owners were denied the ability to use their resort, yet have to pay the SA and pay MF's without the right to use.

[Brit34 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Brit34]

Diamond Resorts Fees

The owners cant vote on anything. The DRI people get their own people in there. This is not legal in Hawaii but they manage to get around it. They are also supposed to give out a list of owners. Wont do that either.
DRI states that they cant get the insurance company to pay for repairs to the water damage at the Point. This is untrue as they did get a large amount from their Insurance Company of about $10 mil. They are asking owners at the Point to pay increased Maintenance fees. Our went from $300.00 three years ago to $1500.00 for 2012. We are also being charged $3684.00 towards their water damage. We only have every other year.This is also being charged to anyone who owns in Hawaii and hasnt even been to Kuaii.
Mr. Stephen Cloobeck the CEO is also being featured on an English TV programme regards to Scams and the Mirror Newspaper in London has been publishing letters from Angry owners in Europe. They are being allowed now to turn in their units but must sign a gagging order not to talk about DRI.
$10,000.00 fine and court action if you talk about them.

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

And what about owners and their annual usage rights and the rights of trust members? I would imagine there would be an even larger outcry if owners were denied the ability to use their resort, yet have to pay the SA and pay MF's without the right to use.

Yeah - that too.

[pseda Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close pseda]

If additional assessments do get levied in future years it will most likely be due to higher than planned delinquencies by owners. I'm not a DRI fan, and they have not handled this well at all. They are also not the evil villain that the "Angry" folks want to blame for this mess... they talk like DRI planned this whole thing as a conspiracy for cryin' out loud.

To your strategic point, I have also wondered if it would make more sense to just close the place down and do it all at once. Why not get the work finished completely, and re-open with the project entirely out of the way? It shouldn't take any more than a year I would think?

The drip, drip, drip, over a couple of years - no pun intended - will only pro-long this disaster.

Close it down for a year would be an idea or depending on bottom line, bulldoze and start anew.

[singlemalt_18 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close singlemalt_18]

Probably because that would mean everybody would need to pay their entire assessment now instead of spread out over three years (or more for some owners).

It would also tremendously disrupt staffing, as the entire housekeeping and maintenance staff would be laid off during the rebuild, and they would find new work during that period.

Finally - and certainly not least for the real decision-makers at the resort - it would be difficult to conduct sales operations at a resort that is being rebuilt and that has no guests who can be routed through the sales presentation.

And what about owners and their annual usage rights and the rights of trust members? I would imagine there would be an even larger outcry if owners were denied the ability to use their resort, yet have to pay the SA and pay MF's without the right to use.

All good points that further clarify that the fiduciary duty many are questioning is a duty to the owners collectively, based on protecting the property asset at large. There is no duty to consider each and every individual's personal cash flow statement and balance sheet, and that is the essence of the no-win scenario, the Kobayashi Maru.

Beam me up, please!

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

And what about owners and their annual usage rights and the rights of trust members? I would imagine there would be an even larger outcry if owners were denied the ability to use their resort, yet have to pay the SA and pay MF's without the right to use.

As if you had a hurricane or fire or whatever that destroyed your vacation home or house or condo - even though you can't use it until it is repaired you still owe taxes, maintenance, etc. No different for a timeshare if for some reason it has to be totally closed for whatever reason. It has occurred in soe places in the past. h

[Brit34 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Brit34]

Diamond RESORTS INT

I agree that if I own a holiday house or condo I will have to pay for insurance and /or repairs but when its finished it will still be mine. With DRI I have owned for three years. I have paid my maitenance fees $1500.00 this next year. I have called within the 13 month stage and have been told that they have no space as I belong to the Hawaiian Collection. As retired military and retirees on social security we cant afford to pay $3800.00 water damage and $1500 maintenance for a unit where we cant stay.
I want out but am told by DRI that I cant get out of paying until 2045.
You say dont get angry at the DRI people. Well they are money hungry. Last week in the Las Vagas paper the CEO Mr. Cloobeck gave a Mill to the President and havs now been given a place on the US Tourist Assoc Board. You can read about this in many papers. If you want to get all of the story go to DRIP (Diamond Resorts International Protestors) Its a fantastic site and they have administrators who find rules and information about DRI that I found incredible.Its primarily for the EU members but they are also trying to help the US members and the other site ownerrs at the Point at Poipu is another great information site.

[singlemalt_18 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close singlemalt_18]

I have called within the 13 month stage and have been told that they have no space as I belong to the Hawaiian Collection. As retired military and retirees on social security we cant afford to pay $3800.00 water damage and $1500 maintenance for a unit where we cant stay.

Brit34 - I'm don't understand why you are having difficulty with 13 month advance planning... I was just in the system yesterday and there are a couple units available at both Poipu and KBC within the next few weeks? For half points no less under the 59 day rates!

I also do not understand why you are being charged $3,800 for the assessment on top of a $1,500 maintenance fee? For 2012, our total hawaiian collection fees on 10,500 pts is about $1,800 and our SA comes to another $1,800 including exise tax. Our total amount to pay is $3,600.

The SA cost per point is about 17 cents... do you have over 22,000 points? If so, did you prepay a portion of your MF?

[Brit34 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Brit34]

Diamond Resorts Fees

Singlemalt18. Well I don’t understand why we are having trouble. First off I don’t want a unit in the holidays as you mentioned. I want one in March as we have friends we wanted to join. They offered me one in Maui one year. We wanted an every other year at Poipu but they told us it was to our advantage to buy into the Hawaii Collection. Less expensive maintenance and always easy to get to Popiu.
Our first M fee in 2008 was $423.81 the next was $902.14 the 2011 was $1629.22. We then got a water assessment fee for $3481.11 although the Assessment payment schedule shows that every other year will be $2946.66. We have 8500 points. This means they are expecting us to pay a total of $5901.83 for a TS they we have not been able to use. On top of this we can’t turn it in and we have been advised that we can expect one of the following. 1. Lockout letter sent to delinquent members. (We have been locked out for three years already. 2. Submit delinquent accounts to an attorney. 3. Engagement of a professional collection agency. 4. Recovery of points through enforcement of security interest and termination of membership (which we want anyway). 5. Initiation of small claims suit or legal action. We quite welcome the legal action because I would like the opportunity to bring the DRI to everyone’s attention. The EU DRI members are allowed to end membership at the age 75. In the US there is no such thing and you are expected to pay until 2045. I will be 111 then and will make the Guinness book of records. I have all the paperwork for these charges.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

It would be interesting to know what it would cost to build a brand new resort.

Speculated early on in this thread.

I searched condo developments for sale in HA, and asked about building cost (no answer). I could not find an existing condo development for sale in HA anywhere near $300,000 per unit. It's in this thread.

One suggestion I made, I think, was to determine who wants out completely, then determine what it would cost to bulldoze and rebuild just enough resort for the owners that want to stay owners, plus whatever DRI wants to build to sell, at their expense.

Posts 131, 152 & 164.

[donendone Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close donendone]

I think JLB's idea has merit.

Many owners would welcome the prospect of a way out including me.

From a purely financial perspective, investing another $6k per ownership share in a property that has negative market value is a very poor investment. A plan that supports owners who simply want to opt out is the most likely to secure the most backing and votes. Many of us have already presumed that our investment is sunk and just want out without incurring many more years of rising maintenance fees and outrageous special assessments.

The ultimate option would be to get all the buildings condemned due to water intrusion, bulldoze the buildings, sell the remaining property, and distribute the results of the sale to owners. At least there's some potential upside with an end to the entrapment. The board has noted that bulldozing and rebuilding would have 2x the cost of the water intrusion repairs, However, bulldozing and selling the property is an option that may make more sense to a majority of owners especially when compared to 5 years of construction, tight reservations, additional assessments due to defaults, etc. Being an owner for the next 5 years will not be pretty under the best of circumstances. Sometimes the best option is to end it.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

The board has noted that bulldozing and rebuilding would have 2x the cost of the water intrusion repairs

That does not sound as if they considered an opt-out, only rebuilding for those owners who opt-in.

It would be a beautiful location for a smaller property, and rebuilding would open up options not available through repairing.

The advantage of being inclusive in considering decisions is that you never know where the idea for the best options might come from. The more you allow to input, the more ideas you come up with.

For instance, if there were fewer buildings, and the ground floor was a public area (laundry, game room, spa, vending machines, multi-purpose room, BBQ . . . ) in each building, or if the ground floor was elevated relative to the existing structures, or a combination, all living units could be oceanview.
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Another possibility, since there would be fewer owners after the opt-out, it could be that a demolition/rebuilding schedule could be developed that would allow all owners to have usage.
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Another another possibility, that something of this nature could be the exit strategy the entire industry longs for. At the point when structure(s) become outdated, owners could opt-in/opt-out to rebuild new, modern structures.

I know of several timeshares in SW FL that were old when they were converted 30 years ago, that owners may well opt-in for new buildings.

At all resorts suffering from the times, it may also be an encouragement to those who are taking the option of just not paying for, or using, their timeshares, that they may be encouraged that if they will just hang on until . . . . they can legally get out.

Many resorts are ripe for being updated, or past. They have become less than traditional lodging options.