What Does This Mean?

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

If I own a deeded Week at KBC I am not a member of the Club unless I join the Club and give the Hawaiian Trust my Deed.

So what does this mean?

From DRI web site

Members of THE ClubSM that own a deeded week at a specific resort, have Home Resort Advantage and they are able to make reservations at their Home Resort beginning 12 months prior to their check-out date.

Walt

[Werner Member Find all posts View Profile Close Werner]

Under those conditions you can make Home Resort reservations 12 months out. You can make reservations in other club resorts 10 months out. Club members with deeded weeks in other resorts can only make reservations in your Home Resort 10 months out. Its supposed to give the deeded week owner a 2 month head start over other club members.

One of the talking points of the "trusts" (aka "collections") is that trust members supposedly can make reservations 13 months out for trust units. I have never had trouble making reservations at Poipu 12 months out and we have traded into desirable units at KBC 10 months out without difficulty so I don't yet see the value in the trust.

You can only have home resort advantage if you have a deeded week in the club but your first sentence says that you can't do that, that you have to buy into the trust. If so I seems like the paragraph you quoted doesn't apply? If you buy into the trust you can make reservation in the trust units 13 months out. Yes?

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

My Question is

Under those conditions you can make Home Resort reservations 12 months out. You can make reservations in other club resorts 10 months out. Club members with deeded weeks in other resorts can only make reservations in your Home Resort 10 months out. Its supposed to give the deeded week owner a 2 month head start over other club members.

One of the talking points of the "trusts" (aka "collections") is that trust members supposedly can make reservations 13 months out for trust units. I have never had trouble making reservations at Poipu 12 months out and we have traded into desirable units at KBC 10 months out without difficulty so I don't yet see the value in the trust.

You can only have home resort advantage if you have a deeded week in the club but your first sentence says that you can't do that, that you have to buy into the trust. If so I seems like the paragraph you quoted doesn't apply? If you buy into the trust you can make reservation in the trust units 13 months out. Yes?

If you join The Club you must place the Deed of KBC in the Hawaiian Trust. Therefore you have no deed. So how can you be a member of the Club with a Deed?

And are you able to get your deed back or is it part of the Hawaiian Trust for the rest of your life?

Walt

[Werner Member Find all posts View Profile Close Werner]

If you join The Club you must place the Deed of KBC in the Hawaiian Trust. Therefore you have no deed. So how can you be a member of the Club with a Deed?

And are you able to get your deed back or is it part of the Hawaiian Trust for the rest of your life?

Walt

I guess I was asking you that question. I was trying to understand how the document you quote about Home Resort advantage being 12 months applies when you say at the top that you can only buy into the trust which has a 13 month reservation limit.

I am a deeded owner of Poipu only, not the trust, and a member of the club. My "members profile" shows my ownership status. As a member of the club I loan my floating deeded week to the club for them to use as they see fit. In exchange I get XX points to use annually. I can use them at my home resort where I can make reservations 12 months out or elsewhere at a club resort 10 months out or in II at whatever lead time they have, I guess its about 2 years. As far as I can tell from my paperwork, I am still the registered owner of my deed as far as the state of Hawaii is concerned. If I quit the club I will still be the deeded owner of my unit and will make my reservations through the resort directly, just as you do now.

I really don't know how the trust system works. I was just trying to understand why you referred to that DRI website paragraph when you said you can only buy into the trust and that quote doesn't seem to apply to trusts.

[Spence Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Spence]

Under those conditions you can make Home Resort reservations 12 months out. You can make reservations in other club resorts 10 months out. Club members with deeded weeks in other resorts can only make reservations in your Home Resort 10 months out. Its supposed to give the deeded week owner a 2 month head start over other club members.

One of the talking points of the "trusts" (aka "collections") is that trust members supposedly can make reservations 13 months out for trust units. I have never had trouble making reservations at Poipu 12 months out and we have traded into desirable units at KBC 10 months out without difficulty so I don't yet see the value in the trust.

You can only have home resort advantage if you have a deeded week in the club but your first sentence says that you can't do that, that you have to buy into the trust. If so I seems like the paragraph you quoted doesn't apply? If you buy into the trust you can make reservation in the trust units 13 months out. Yes?

If you join The Club you must place the Deed of KBC in the Hawaiian Trust. Therefore you have no deed. So how can you be a member of the Club with a Deed?

And are you able to get your deed back or is it part of the Hawaiian Trust for the rest of your life?

Walt

There have been two ways to join THE Club since the inception of the Trusts. You can turn in your deed and they give you a share of the Trust, this is what DRI wants you to do. It has also been possible to keep your deed and sign an Assignment Agreement giving THE Club the right to use your week in exchange for an annual allotment of points, these are the people that the 12-month window applies to.

One of the talking points of the "trusts" (aka "collections") is that trust members supposedly can make reservations 13 months out for trust units.
The confusion propagated by the sleasemen here is that Trust members can take all the reservations a month before the deeded owner Club members. This is not the case, the Trust 13-month inventory and the deeded Club 12-month inventory are separate until the 10-month window when it's all the same.

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

If you join The Club you must place the Deed of KBC in the Hawaiian Trust. Therefore you have no deed. So how can you be a member of the Club with a Deed?

Wrong.

When you join the Club you can either turn your deed into the Trust and become part of the Trust, or you can keep your deed and transfer your reservation right to the Club. Or at least you formerly had the option; I suspect that if you made it a condition of sale, the option might suddenly become available if it wasn't previously offered.

******

We are both deeded owners and part of the Club. I still make my reservations, through the Club, 12 months in advance. With my 10,000 points I can book any available unit at Poipu, even oceanfront units during holiday season for which the point requirements are substantially more, because that is what is in my deed.

At any time we can terminate our affiliation with the Club and revert to a plain old deeded ownership. Or, if we ever sell, the person who purchases will purchase a conventional deeded ownership, not a Trust UDI.

Note that because we did not add the deed to the trust, our home resort advantage with those points is 12 months instead of the 13-month advantage that associates with the Trust.

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

The confusion propagated by the sleasemen here is that Trust members can take all the reservations a month before the deeded owner Club members. This is not the case, the Trust 13-month inventory and the deeded Club 12-month inventory are separate until the 10-month window when it's all the same.

I have confirmed Spence's statement in conversations with the people who handle reservations for Po'ipu.

What occurs with floating inventory is that the resort inventory in each season/view/size/etc. caegory is allocated among non-Club deeded owners, Club affiliated deeded owners, and Trust ownership in proportion to the amount owned in each category. That ratio is applied as a straight percentage across the entire season.

Example, if the high season, ocean view 2-bedroom units at a given property are owned 50% by trust, 30% by deeded non-Club affiliated, and 20% by deeded Club affiliated, then on each check-in day during high season Trust is limited to one-half of the allowable reservations, deeded non-Club 30%, and deeded Club 20%. Trust owners can begin reserving against their 50% 13 months before check-out date. The others can begin reserving against their inventory 12 months before check-in.

At 10 months out the Club makes remaining inventory in the Trust and deeded Club available to anyone in the Club.

+++++

As I'm thinking this through, there must also be a fourth category, Trust ownership not affiliated with the Club. I'm not completely sure how that is handled, but I suspect that is handled through the Club as Trust inventory, but the points are tagged so that they can only be used at resorts within that Trust.

[Spence Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Spence]

I have confirmed Spence's statement in conversations with the people who handle reservations for Po'ipu.

What occurs with floating inventory is that the resort inventory in each season/view/size/etc. caegory is allocated among non-Club deeded owners, Club affiliated deeded owners, and Trust ownership in proportion to the amount owned in each category. That ratio is applied as a straight percentage across the entire season.

Example, if the high season, ocean view 2-bedroom units at a given property are owned 50% by trust, 30% by deeded non-Club affiliated, and 20% by deeded Club affiliated, then on each check-in day during high season Trust is limited to one-half of the allowable reservations, deeded non-Club 30%, and deeded Club 20%. Trust owners can begin reserving against their 50% 13 months before check-out date. The others can begin reserving against their inventory 12 months before check-in.

At 10 months out the Club makes remaining inventory in the Trust and deeded Club available to anyone in the Club.

+++++

As I'm thinking this through, there must also be a fourth category, Trust ownership not affiliated with the Club. I'm not completely sure how that is handled, but I suspect that is handled through the Club as Trust inventory, but the points are tagged so that they can only be used at resorts within that Trust.

exactly, but no way to prove

[dougp26364 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dougp26364]

If you join The Club you must place the Deed of KBC in the Hawaiian Trust. Therefore you have no deed. So how can you be a member of the Club with a Deed?

And are you able to get your deed back or is it part of the Hawaiian Trust for the rest of your life?

Walt

I think others have covered your question but, just as a FWIW, we own 2 DRI weeks that are deeded weeks but, we are also members of THE Club. You may elect to keep you deed AND be a member of THE Club.

The difference is, trust members can reserve at the 13 month window, I can reserve at the 12 month window for our home resort. Apparently, if I wanted to I could put our Polo Towers units into the Hawaiian Trust. As it stands now I prefer to keep my deeded week.

As a side note, one of my weeks is a floating week and the other is a fixed week. The fixed week I must call and release to DRI to have my account credited with the points for that week. If I want, I can keep that week and use it for personal use. The floating week is automatically exchanged for points and, if I want to use that week, I must reserve a week using my THE Club points.

Before joining THE Club, reserving a week at my home resort using our floating week was a breeze. Since joining THE Club I've looked for inventory and found it to be limited. Essentially, it would be tough for me to get into my home resort using my floating week that was converted into THE Club. If I had wanted to be able to go to my home resort and had converted to THE Club, this would not make me very happy. As it is, we converted to THE Club because we had not been staying at this resort and, had no plans to stay at this resort in the near future. So belonging to a program that would allow us to stretch our usage made sense for us.

If, however, we were inclined to use our home resort week, joining THE Club or the Hawaiian Trust would have been a waste of money and, would likely to have led to additional frustration. If we ever decided we wanted to travel to Hawaii on a regular basis and wanted to stay at DRI resorts, then joining the Hawaiian Trust may have been a decent option, even though we'd be giving up our deeds. But that would only be if we wanted ownership rights in Hawaii through DRI, which at this point in time we do not.

[Werner Member Find all posts View Profile Close Werner]

re Dougs comment about getting back into your home resort after you join the club... That is an important consideration that is very hard to resolve if you are not already a member of the Club, Catch 22, you have to join the club to have access to the computer reservations system to test availability to decide whether you want to join the club. My own experience at is that 12 months works fine at my Home Resort, Poipu, and 10 months seems to work fine trading into KBC. KBC always seems to have non-holiday weeks available, even into the less-than-60 day half points period, although they are not the most desirable unit categories. Apparently, Polo Towers is harder to get into through the Club. It would be maddening if 12 months out you couldn't get into your home resort.

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

Could It be because there are more Weeks owners?

From the DRI web Site about KBC:

If this true about KBC, could the numbers for the other Resort be similar?

Walt

Diamond Resorts owns approximately 7.8% of the inventory and the Diamond Resorts Hawaii Collection owns just over 18.9%. The Diamond Resorts Hawaii Collection has a Board that is also elected annually and has four Diamond employees serving as Directors. Traditional owners like yourself compromise about 73.3% of Ka'anapali ownership. Board members are determined by those owners who actually vote in the elections. As is the case in many national and civic elections, Diamond Resorts and the Diamond Resorts Hawaii Collection cast their votes in each election while many other owners choose not to exercise this right.

I think others have covered your question but, just as a FWIW, we own 2 DRI weeks that are deeded weeks but, we are also members of THE Club. You may elect to keep you deed AND be a member of THE Club.

The difference is, trust members can reserve at the 13 month window, I can reserve at the 12 month window for our home resort. Apparently, if I wanted to I could put our Polo Towers units into the Hawaiian Trust. As it stands now I prefer to keep my deeded week.

As a side note, one of my weeks is a floating week and the other is a fixed week. The fixed week I must call and release to DRI to have my account credited with the points for that week. If I want, I can keep that week and use it for personal use. The floating week is automatically exchanged for points and, if I want to use that week, I must reserve a week using my THE Club points.

Before joining THE Club, reserving a week at my home resort using our floating week was a breeze. Since joining THE Club I've looked for inventory and found it to be limited. Essentially, it would be tough for me to get into my home resort using my floating week that was converted into THE Club. If I had wanted to be able to go to my home resort and had converted to THE Club, this would not make me very happy. As it is, we converted to THE Club because we had not been staying at this resort and, had no plans to stay at this resort in the near future. So belonging to a program that would allow us to stretch our usage made sense for us.

If, however, we were inclined to use our home resort week, joining THE Club or the Hawaiian Trust would have been a waste of money and, would likely to have led to additional frustration. If we ever decided we wanted to travel to Hawaii on a regular basis and wanted to stay at DRI resorts, then joining the Hawaiian Trust may have been a decent option, even though we'd be giving up our deeds. But that would only be if we wanted ownership rights in Hawaii through DRI, which at this point in time we do not.

[winger Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close winger]

.... Apparently, Polo Towers is harder to get into through the Club. ....

I can honestly say this is very likely attributed to the Club having just started recruiting new members at Polo not too long ago versus other resorts (e.g. Point or KBC or LTVR), resulting in less CLUB inventory for Polo for Club members' use.