my vri timeshare is worthless

[dustin Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dustin]

I own a 1br at villas of sedona which is managed by vri. A year ago the hoa was taking back deeds and giving the owner 1500. Now the resort says that they will take back deed but now the owner will pay the resort 400 when giving the deed back to the resort to cover the cost of transfer and title search. It appears from looking at public records, the association would take many deeds in, and then would sell many in one transaction to the vacation international trust. I notice the the most recent of these transfers did not have an affadaivit of value filed with them. while the ones prevoiusly did show money paid for them. I guess the VI trust must have enough of these units, but will take more of them for free. fees seem to be somewhat high at this resort. was about 620 for a 1br. 2br are about 650. seems many people are still giving thier weeks back to the resort. What is going to be the future of this resort I am wondering.

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

Management companies connected to a developer are a very dangerous animal for other owners. I would not even consider owning at such a resort. The conflict of interest is too great. I have been watching some of the very curious foreclosure and deedback practices of Barrier Island Station, which is a developer still managing resorts, the only such arrangement left on the Outer Banks. Several resorts had concerned owner groups go to court to kick out developer management, one of which went all the way to the NC Supreme Court.

[katiemack Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close katiemack]

Sure doesn't sound good.

If you are afraid of being stuck with something that won't be well managed, why not just sell it and take what you can get for it?

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

I own a 1br at villas of sedona which is managed by vri. A year ago the hoa was taking back deeds and giving the owner 1500. Now the resort says that they will take back deed but now the owner will pay the resort 400 when giving the deed back to the resort to cover the cost of transfer and title search. It appears from looking at public records, the association would take many deeds in, and then would sell many in one transaction to the vacation international trust.

I'm pretty baffled by what you are talking about here. As far as I am aware, there is no such thing as a "vacation international trust" that is run by VRI. Vacation Internationale is a multi-resort program whose board of directors has hired VRI to manage the resorts. But there is no VRI trust; VRI manages the resorts only because they were hired by Vacation Internationale to provide those services. That was after the Vacation Internationale Board terminated the management contract with Sunterra.

I'm pretty sure there is no VRI trust. There probably is a VI trust, which holds the properties on behalf of VRI members. But there is no relationship between VRI and the VI trust, outside of the situation that the VI retained VRI to provide management services.

Despite the similarity in names, VI (Vacation International) and VRI (Vacation Resorts International) are two completely separate companies. The only link between them is that the owner controlled VI board of directors has hired VRI to provide management services.

Management companies connected to a developer are a very dangerous animal for other owners. I would not even consider owning at such a resort. The conflict of interest is too great. I have been watching some of the very curious foreclosure and deedback practices of Barrier Island Station, which is a developer still managing resorts, the only such arrangement left on the Outer Banks. Several resorts had concerned owner groups go to court to kick out developer management, one of which went all the way to the NC Supreme Court.

As far as I am aware, VRI has no connection with any developer. To the contrary, VRI's market niche is providing management services to resorts that are no longer controlled by developers. For example, when Vacation Internationale terminated the management contract with Sunterra, and hired VRI to provide management services.

******

Personally, I think that VRI will become increasingly attractive to owner controlled resorts. The VRIety internal exchange program will provide owner controlled resorts with a multi-resort independent exchange program similar to that provided by mini-systems, at lower cost to owners than RCI or II exchanges and without requiring the resort to be a vassal of the exchange company.

[jericap Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close jericap]

I own a 1br at villas of sedona which is managed by vri. A year ago the hoa was taking back deeds and giving the owner 1500. Now the resort says that they will take back deed but now the owner will pay the resort 400 when giving the deed back to the resort to cover the cost of transfer and title search. It appears from looking at public records, the association would take many deeds in, and then would sell many in one transaction to the vacation international trust. I notice the the most recent of these transfers did not have an affadaivit of value filed with them. while the ones prevoiusly did show money paid for them. I guess the VI trust must have enough of these units, but will take more of them for free. fees seem to be somewhat high at this resort. was about 620 for a 1br. 2br are about 650. seems many people are still giving thier weeks back to the resort. What is going to be the future of this resort I am wondering.

I've owned a 2 BR at the Villas of Sedona for the last 4 years and am curious as to how/when you found out the HOA was taking deeds back?
I have never received any communication about the above and find it interesting.
I also own own a couple more weeks where VRI is the management company and have found them to be very responsible.

[Beaglemom3 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Beaglemom3]

I own a 1br at villas of sedona which is managed by vri. A year ago the hoa was taking back deeds and giving the owner 1500. Now the resort says that they will take back deed but now the owner will pay the resort 400 when giving the deed back to the resort to cover the cost of transfer and title search. It appears from looking at public records, the association would take many deeds in, and then would sell many in one transaction to the vacation international trust. I notice the the most recent of these transfers did not have an affadaivit of value filed with them. while the ones prevoiusly did show money paid for them. I guess the VI trust must have enough of these units, but will take more of them for free. fees seem to be somewhat high at this resort. was about 620 for a 1br. 2br are about 650. seems many people are still giving thier weeks back to the resort. What is going to be the future of this resort I am wondering.

Dustin,
I hope this isn't some sort of scam, not by VRI, but by an external company.
Please contact the Arizona Attorney General's office. Notify whoever sent you this notice that this is what you're doing.
Arizona Attorney General, Terry Goddard
B.

[lawren2 Malibu Beach Barbie & A Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close lawren2]

I'm pretty baffled by what you are talking about here. As far as I am aware, there is no such thing as a "vacation international trust" that is run by VRI. Vacation Internationale is a multi-resort program whose board of directors has hired VRI to manage the resorts. But there is no VRI trust; VRI manages the resorts only because they were hired by Vacation Internationale to provide those services. That was after the Vacation Internationale Board terminated the management contract with Sunterra.

I'm pretty sure there is no VRI trust. There probably is a VI trust, which holds the properties on behalf of VRI members. But there is no relationship between VRI and the VI trust, outside of the situation that the VI retained VRI to provide management services.

Despite the similarity in names, VI (Vacation International) and VRI (Vacation Resorts International) are two completely separate companies. The only link between them is that the owner controlled VI board of directors has hired VRI to provide management services.



As far as I am aware, VRI has no connection with any developer. To the contrary, VRI's market niche is providing management services to resorts that are no longer controlled by developers. For example, when Vacation Internationale terminated the management contract with Sunterra, and hired VRI to provide management services.

******

Personally, I think that VRI will become increasingly attractive to owner controlled resorts. The VRIety internal exchange program will provide owner controlled resorts with a multi-resort independent exchange program similar to that provided by mini-systems, at lower cost to owners than RCI or II exchanges and without requiring the resort to be a vassal of the exchange company.

as a note to Steve's post I have seen the Vacation Internationale and VRI exchange databases. They are set up in a very similar fashion. Within a specific resort they will post how many weeks &/or units that are available for exchange to the membership.

Vacation Resorts International (VRI) - Perfecting the Art of Hospitality
Vacation Internationale - Resort Locations

It may be likely that the deed backs are being used to stock the exchange pool while bailing out distressed owners.

All a guess on my part.

[1950bing Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 1950bing]

Sure doesn't sound good.

If you are afraid of being stuck with something that won't be well managed, why not just sell it and take what you can get for it?

Why would one who is in the timeshare family suggest to another to sell it knowing all the problems? The owner is not happy with it so why would the new owner be happy? It's like to heck with the new owner, let it become his problem and let him deal with all the mess. A buyer beware deal ! Does not sound as if that is good advice.

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

It's not a VRI Resort its a VRI Managed Resort

I own a 1br at villas of sedona which is managed by vri. A year ago the hoa was taking back deeds and giving the owner 1500. Now the resort says that they will take back deed but now the owner will pay the resort 400 when giving the deed back to the resort to cover the cost of transfer and title search. It appears from looking at public records, the association would take many deeds in, and then would sell many in one transaction to the vacation international trust. I notice the the most recent of these transfers did not have an affadaivit of value filed with them. while the ones prevoiusly did show money paid for them. I guess the VI trust must have enough of these units, but will take more of them for free. fees seem to be somewhat high at this resort. was about 620 for a 1br. 2br are about 650. seems many people are still giving thier weeks back to the resort. What is going to be the future of this resort I am wondering.

VRI is a management company NOT a developer. You own at a VRI Managed resort. If they aren't doing the job then your Board could switch management companies. But they don't buy units, sell weeks or own resorts. They are an independent management company only and, in my experience, do a great job at running resorts as directed by the HOA Board. If you have issues go to the Board it's not VRI (although I'm sure they will pass along any comments you may have to the Board members). If the resort was taking back weeks last year but not this year it is an issue for the Association not VRI. They do as they are directed by the Board.

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

as a note to Steve's post I have seen the Vacation Internationale and VRI exchange databases. They are set up in a very similar fashion. Within a specific resort they will post how many weeks &/or units that are available for exchange to the membership.

Since VRI is the management company for VI, it makes sense that they would use the same or similar databases.

[lawren2 Malibu Beach Barbie & A Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close lawren2]

Since VRI is the management company for VI, it makes sense that they would use the same or similar databases.

Actually VRIety is supposed to be re-using the ORE exchange database. I don't recall the ORE database being that way but I only looked at it once or twice years ago. I was surprised at the similarities between what I've been getting from VRI and what I remember with my 2 very short glances at the VI though.

VRI is not on-line as of yet. VI is.

[janapur Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close janapur]

Why would one who is in the timeshare family suggest to another to sell it knowing all the problems? The owner is not happy with it so why would the new owner be happy? It's like to heck with the new owner, let it become his problem and let him deal with all the mess. A buyer beware deal ! Does not sound as if that is good advice.

I don't think the intention would be to pull something over on an unsuspecting buyer. Ebay has tons of weeks that have low value due to a variety of problems.

I purchased my 2BR oceanfront VRI managed unit fully aware of the potential problems, but not the assesment. Good thing the price was right. I have no regrets because that week pulled President's week on Maui due to the VRI preference.

I would hope that all ebay purchasers are aware that some due diligence is necessary. Buyer beware indeed.

[dustin Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close dustin]

I do not really think this is a bad resort. In fact I think it is a great resort to stay at. the first timeshare I bought was a 1br there. It was bought on ebay for about 700 total cost. I thought it was a good deal but shortly after that I bought a 2br same resort for about 800. Also went on somewhat of a buying binge and ended up with more than practical. So I called the resort directly and asked if there was a resale office on site. That person said the hoa would give 1500 and take the deed back. I happily agreed to that. they had the deed drawn up, I had it notarized and mailed it back. they recorded the deed and a few weeks later I got the check for 1500. so I made about 800 of the week. I did pay 2 mf and use the weeks in rci. got fairly decent trades out of it. I swore not to by any more ts but I still liked to watch the ebay auctions of the resorts I own at. some thing possesed me to bid on another 1br when there was one for 100+150closing+75transfer fee. I was the only bidder. I certainly didnt need another one but for 325 how could I pass this up If I could turn around and get 1500 for in from the resort. I figured Id better At least pay one years mf so it wouldn't look like I bought it solely to flip. In case someone was looking into it. so my quick profit turned into possible break even or slight loss since now It would cost 400 to give it back to the resort. Im sure some one would take it for free. I still see most of the units on ebay getting bids, so Im sure I will not be stuck with it forever. I still think it is surpising that the resort will charge you to take your deed back. but they also are very agressive at taking back the deeds on non maintence fee payers. There are many jugjements on the public records for people not paying their mf and they take the deed and get judgement for late mf and 900+ attorney fees.

[T. R. Oglodyte Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close T. R. Oglodyte]

I do not really think this is a bad resort. In fact I think it is a great resort to stay at. the first timeshare I bought was a 1br there. It was bought on ebay for about 700 total cost. I thought it was a good deal but shortly after that I bought a 2br same resort for about 800. Also went on somewhat of a buying binge and ended up with more than practical. So I called the resort directly and asked if there was a resale office on site. That person said the hoa would give 1500 and take the deed back. I happily agreed to that. they had the deed drawn up, I had it notarized and mailed it back. they recorded the deed and a few weeks later I got the check for 1500. so I made about 800 of the week. I did pay 2 mf and use the weeks in rci. got fairly decent trades out of it. I swore not to by any more ts but I still liked to watch the ebay auctions of the resorts I own at. some thing possesed me to bid on another 1br when there was one for 100+150closing+75transfer fee. I was the only bidder. I certainly didnt need another one but for 325 how could I pass this up If I could turn around and get 1500 for in from the resort. I figured Id better At least pay one years mf so it wouldn't look like I bought it solely to flip. In case someone was looking into it. so my quick profit turned into possible break even or slight loss since now It would cost 400 to give it back to the resort. Im sure some one would take it for free. I still see most of the units on ebay getting bids, so Im sure I will not be stuck with it forever. I still think it is surpising that the resort will charge you to take your deed back. but they also are very agressive at taking back the deeds on non maintence fee payers. There are many jugjements on the public records for people not paying their mf and they take the deed and get judgement for late mf and 900+ attorney fees.

Let's parse these issues out a bit, as deedback and foreclosure/judgment are separate items, and VRI's role differs somewhat, at least as I understand VRI.

Let's take foreclosure first. VRI, as a management company, stresses timely payment by owners of monies owed, aggressive renting of available space (including space that would go to delinquent owners), and proceeding with foreclosures on non-paying units. In fact, VRI's services in collections and revenue generation are part of the sales used by VRI when marketing HOAs for management contracts. Usually those matters are pretty straightforward and addressed in timeshare covenants and other documents. These matters can be done with little board action (and at many resorts with more passive HOAs I suspect there is little real oversight of this aspect of VRI's operations.

Deedbacks, on the other hand, are often not addressed in timeshare documents. Accordingly, a deedback program can usually be implemented only with direction from the HOA Board, and the terms and policies of the deedback program will be set by the HOA Board. Once established by the Board, VRI can implement the program. But the policies for the HOA, including pricing, will be set by the HOA Board.

Of course, VRI is going to provide input to the HOA Board on what VRI thinks is the best program, and many resort HOA Boards are likely to rubber stamp whatever VRI recommends. But ultimately, if there is a change in a buyback program that change is there because has been approved by the HOA Board.

[JudyS Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close JudyS]

as a note to Steve's post I have seen the Vacation Internationale and VRI exchange databases. They are set up in a very similar fashion. Within a specific resort they will post how many weeks &/or units that are available for exchange to the membership.....

Actually VRIety is supposed to be re-using the ORE exchange database. I don't recall the ORE database being that way but I only looked at it once or twice years ago. I was surprised at the similarities between what I've been getting from VRI and what I remember with my 2 very short glances at the VI though.

VRI is not on-line as of yet. VI is.

The old ORE online exchange database would say what weeks were available at what resort, and which color season they were, but not how many units were available for a given check-in date, or even what size unit they were. So, the VI & VRI databases sound quite different.

Lawren, have you gotten to see the new VRI*ety exchange database, or are you talking about some older database? Either way, I am very interested in anything you've learned.