How Many Came Out Ahead, & Vice Versa?

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

I was an HOA president for a number of years, and board member for years before that. During that time I developed quite a few contacts with both HOA presidents and board members and some managers and the local reseller in our resort area. When I am back in the States, I visit the area and talk with some of those I know. I also talk to some of them occaisionally, especially the HOA board members, by phone.

I also tend to ask questions about some of the areas I have concerns about in talking with management at other resorts I own at.

Indeed, even at resorts I trade into, I enjoy trying to find a time that the resort manager or an assistant is accessible to talk shop a bit. One resort I traded into was having a board meeting at the resort during the weekend at the start of my week, and one board member was staying in the unit next door. When we chatted and he found out I had recently been an HOA president in the States, he invited me to the board's cocktail party that evening. That was a particularly interesting opportunity to chat with board members of a homeowner-run resort in the UK.

Just curious Carolinian, how do you hear from all these resort managers, board members and resellers?

Are you a TS reseller?
You sure seem to have lots of friends in the TS business.

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

RCI has clearly moved the goalposts for its exchange system. Part of what most buyers from developers were told came in the form or videos and printed material prepared and provided by RCI. RCI is now making a lie of what they presented in those materials.

The alternative for Weeks owners no longer exists with RCI. It exists in moving to other exchange companies, whether II or one of the independents. RCI no longer has a true Weeks system; it has two variations of points systems.

I find it strange how some find it offensive, or a bother, or whatever you wanna call it, to check to see if they have been screwed or not, if they can, or can't, still get everything they have gotten in the past with one deposit.

Sure, anyone can do, or not do, anything they want to, or don't wanna do.

But, I find it strange that some who are in the know don't seem to wanna know this particular thing.

What's the sentiment OY? Do some there not wanna know, too?
- - - - - -
All of us, at some point, were told that owning a timeshare is a method to lock in future vacation costs. That was assuming one deposit gets one exchange. That was the implied promise and there never was even a hint of a notion that would not always be the case.

That's not true anymore, likely for millions who believed what they were told, and bought based on that. No one ever asked if we wanted to opt into anything else, or offered compensation for opting out of timeshares they devalued.

The is Points system for those who preferred that, which is a choice. But, there was no choice for Weeks members.

[chriskre Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close chriskre]

I was an HOA president for a number of years, and board member for years before that. During that time I developed quite a few contacts with both HOA presidents and board members and some managers and the local reseller in our resort area. When I am back in the States, I visit the area and talk with some of those I know. I also talk to some of them occaisionally, especially the HOA board members, by phone.

Interesting.

I've thought of getting involved in my little favorite TS but I think the management is doing such a good job I don't wanna mess it up.

The alternative for Weeks owners no longer exists with RCI. It exists in moving to other exchange companies, whether II or one of the independents. RCI no longer has a true Weeks system; it has two variations of points systems.

Even though RCI's TPU's are "points" you can't exchange them for less than a weeks stay like you can with true points systems, so doesn't that still make them a weeks system?

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Part of what most buyers from developers were told came in the form or videos and printed material prepared and provided by RCI. RCI is now making a lie of what they presented in those materials.

Of Course . . . the whole world of timesharing knows that, that RCI provides the training material and tells the affiliates what to say. Our very first introduction to timesharing, at our very first tour, at Orange Lake, was to sit in a small room in what is now the West Village Clubhouse and listen to a 100% RCI video.

Then they deny it, say they are separate entities operating separate from each other.

And, yes, they are absoultely making a lie out of everything that has been said to every prospect . . . basically ever.

An important aspect of the Classaction Settlement Agreement is that the Court did not buy that RCI and the affiliates operate separately, and RCI is legally obligated by that agreement to police the affiliates' marketing.

Doing what they have done, especailly during the period where they should be under the scrutiny of the Court, is shocking.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Part of what most buyers from developers were told came in the form or videos and printed material prepared and provided by RCI. RCI is now making a lie of what they presented in those materials.

Therein is the cruxt of the matter.

The buy where you want to go dribble of recent years is, in reality, a minority mantra evolved in reaction to unilateral changes by RCI (primarily, suspicious use of SpaceBank deposits).

Reality is that tens of millions of timeshare prosects were pitched the benefits of exchanging, and still are, and by RCI's own marketing surveys and promotions, the ability to exchange was/is a primary reason for buying for all but a very small minority of timeshare owners.

First google hit:

"88.5% of all timeshare purchases ever made by current RCI members were positively influenced by the RCI exchange opportunity, according to members. These total about 2,686,000 weeks, representing aggregate sales of an estimated $20.1 billion by developers, homeowners associations, and on-site resale companies."

http://www.rci.com/CDA/HTML/PDF_Conv...803_Ragatz.pdf

Exchanging is what made timeshares a viable product.

Exchanging was the first thing we heard in our first tour more than 20 years, the only thing we heard in our last tour, not all that long ago, and the primary focus of all the tours in between.

Even those saying to drop RCI, are saying to find another way to exchange . . . same message.

& we all know what was said, "Buy here and go anywhere you want."

Doesn't it seem suspect that the same company that said the above in order to get affiliations and sales, would now say, "You shoulda bought where you want to go." ???

[chriskre Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close chriskre]

Therein is the cruxt of the matter.

The buy where you want to go dribble of recent years is, in reality, a minority mantra evolved in reaction to unilateral changes by RCI (primarily, suspicious use of SpaceBank deposits).

Reality is that tens of millions of timeshare prosects were pitched the benefits of exchanging, and still are, and by RCI's own marketing surveys and promotions, the ability to exchange was/is a primary reason for buying for all but a very small minority of timeshare owners.

Even those saying to drop RCI, are saying to find another way to exchange . . . same message.

& we all know what was said, "Buy here and go anywhere you want."

Doesn't it seem suspect that the same company that said the above in order to get affiliations and sales, would now say, "You shoulda bought where you want to go." ???

I guess I'm in the minority then, because I bought my weeks initially with the intention of using them as a second home at the beach and had NOOO desire to exchange ever til I discovered RCI's website and TUG. I also see some of the same people year after year at my timeshare who are doing the same thing.

If someone tells you to jump off a bridge in a pretty little video are you gonna do it? When does one accept personal responsibility for their decisions?
Are you saying the American public is so naive that they can't spot a sales pitch when they see one?

We can't always blame the big bad corporate world for our personal decisions.
Last time I attended a sales presentation no was holding a gun to my head making me sign my life away.

Were they doing that to you?
No, you bought because of the same greed that drives RCI. Wanting to extract more value out of something than what you were putting into it.
Not that there is anything wrong with that.

[jlwquilter Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close jlwquilter]

I guess I'm in the minority then, because I bought my weeks initially with the intention of using them as a second home at the beach and had NOOO desire to exchange ever til I discovered RCI's website and TUG. I also see some of the same people year after year at my timeshare who are doing the same thing.

If someone tells you to jump off a bridge in a pretty little video are you gonna do it? When does one accept personal responsibility for their decisions?
Are you saying the American public is so naive that they can't spot a sales pitch when they see one?

We can't always blame the big bad corporate world for our personal decisions.
Last time I attended a sales presentation no was holding a gun to my head making me sign my life away.

Were they doing that to you?
No, you bought because of the same greed that drives RCI. Wanting to extract more value out of something than what you were putting into it.
Not that there is anything wrong with that.

Absolutely. But the main difference is when I do that stuff I am being smart, frugal, savvy, etc. When they do it, they are lying, cheating SOBs that should burn for eternity.

You are wrong on one thing however. We certainly can blame them. It's not their fault, but we sure can blame them anyway! Free will only seems to come into play for some people (no one here obviously) when the results are positive.

[jlwquilter Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close jlwquilter]

I find it strange how some find it offensive, or a bother, or whatever you wanna call it, to check to see if they have been screwed or not, if they can, or can't, still get everything they have gotten in the past with one deposit.

Sure, anyone can do, or not do, anything they want to, or don't wanna do.

But, I find it strange that some who are in the know don't seem to wanna know this particular thing.

What's the sentiment OY? Do some there not wanna know, too?
- - - - - -
All of us, at some point, were told that owning a timeshare is a method to lock in future vacation costs. That was assuming one deposit gets one exchange. That was the implied promise and there never was even a hint of a notion that would not always be the case.

That's not true anymore, likely for millions who believed what they were told, and bought based on that. No one ever asked if we wanted to opt into anything else, or offered compensation for opting out of timeshares they devalued.

The is Points system for those who preferred that, which is a choice. But, there was no choice for Weeks members.

What I truly don't understand is how knowing this particular piece of information helps me one tiny bit in getting what I want going forward, in dealing with RCI today. If I knew that, I might decide that knowing this factoid from the past is indeed worth my time finding it out. Seriously, can you tell me?

[chriskre Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close chriskre]

Absolutely. But the main difference is when I do that stuff I am being smart, frugal, savvy, etc. When they do it, they are lying, cheating SOBs that should burn for eternity.

You are wrong on one thing however. We certainly can blame them. It's not their fault, but we sure can blame them anyway! Free will only seems to come into play for some people (no one here obviously) when the results are positive.

Amen, sister Jayne.

And you are totally right. We CAN blame anyone.
It's how our lawyers stay afloat.
Can't blame them now can ya?

I mean, all that money they made on that RCI lawsuit and it made it sooooo much better for us peons.

I finally used my settlement week before it expired and went to Orlando. Yippie!

I don't have to wonder why RCI doesn't care what we think of them.
I don't care what they think about me either.

When I feel there is no longer value exchanging with them then I'll be done with them. No b-tching, moaning and groaning about it, just DONE with them, period. I'm not at that point yet so I appreciate the service they provide.

Have you ever tried doing a direct exchange? It's alot of work and putting alot of trust and faith in a total stranger that you hope doesn't betray you.
I've been lucky so far in the few times that I've done it but it ain't easy, that's for sure.

So the alternative is to buy where you wanna go or use some other exchange company that doesn't have inventory where you wanna go.
I dunno, but this just seems like a gerbils wheel spinning round and round and round and going nowhere.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

At this particular time, it is an important piece of information, legally. In the not-too-distant future, it may not be all that important. There are people other than just the few of us here watching, keeping score.

But, like I've said, for those who don't care, there is no obligation to do anything to find out where they stand, relative to looking back or going forward.

It's as simple as some care and some don't. Some have a zeal for consumerism, some don't. Some of those who have that zeal, have a hard time understanding why those who don't don't, and some of those who don't have that zeal apparently have a hard time understanding why those who do do.

There's no need for those on either side to snipe at those on the other.

Have a nice day.

[chriskre Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close chriskre]

Was I being snippy?

I'm sorry.
I still love you Jim even if I'm totally clueless to your cause.

[bezerk Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close bezerk]

I have to say with the new RCI additions I am even, no better or worse, least as far as I can see now.

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

I have to say with the new RCI additions I am even, no better or worse, least as far as I can see now.

Gracias.

I'm taking that to mean that there are no previous exchanges that you cannot still get with one deposit.

Tenga un día agradable.

[bezerk Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close bezerk]

Gracias.

I'm taking that to mean that there are no previous exchanges that you cannot still get with one deposit.

Tenga un día agradable.

Es verdad! Correcto! tenga un buen noche!

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

Some also realize that by a major exchange company moving the goalposts in exchanging, it encourages bailouts form resort ownership by owners who exchange and are not happy with the exchange company changes. They also realize that those bailouts will impact everyone else's m/f at the resort, and that burying ones head in the sand is a foolish response to such changes.

We need to be proactive and encourage our resorts to promote other exchanging options, and if not already dual affiliated, to dual affiliate with II.

At this particular time, it is an important piece of information, legally. In the not-too-distant future, it may not be all that important. There are people other than just the few of us here watching, keeping score.

But, like I've said, for those who don't care, there is no obligation to do anything to find out where they stand, relative to looking back or going forward.

It's as simple as some care and some don't. Some have a zeal for consumerism, some don't. Some of those who have that zeal, have a hard time understanding why those who don't don't, and some of those who don't have that zeal apparently have a hard time understanding why those who do do.

There's no need for those on either side to snipe at those on the other.

Have a nice day.