Your Take on Ask RCI Question!

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

I already have it!!

I get Paris if you'll get London.

The following 1 Resort Has availability during your requested time frame.

La Residence Normande 2572 Connelles, FRANCE 6/2 01/20/2007 - 02/17/2007
- - - - - -

Hi Jim,

I already have it for June, 16 2007. The only problem it isn't in Paris. It is about 100 km from Paris.

Walt

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

Maybe someone will buy them out!

I believe there has been enough energy expended expressing that sentiment to keep Wisconsin warm for ten winters.

Realistically, not just idealistically, how do you think this can be done, force RCI to be just an exchange company again?

Cuz' after all, we all know the temptation to rent is just too great for a company like Cendant, don't we?

Hi Jim,

Winter in Wisconsin is Wonderful!

I don't think RCI will ever be an Exchange Company only again as long as Cendant owns it.

However, I believe that the history of Cendant has been to milk a company and then sell the remains. Maybe this will happen with RCI and the buyer will be more timeshare owner friendly.

Walt

[timeos2 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close timeos2]

Rentals are a curse brought on by unequal trade requests

:
I think it is wrong to Rent Owner's Spacebank Prime Time Weeks in Prime Locations to the general public before the Exchange Company's Members have a chance to trade into that Resort.

Walt

Walt - While the underlying thought - only an owner gets another timeshare owners time - is seemingly a good one it can't actually work that way 100%. If it did there would be no reason for anyone to buy a DVC or Marriott week and ever place it for a trade since that week would be snatched up by a much lower value owner. Period. There is no incentive to buy, own and support good weeks and resorts if, as the time honored sales pitch goes, owning any old cheap, off season week can trade to anywhere in the world. There has to be a leveling of value which means that an owner of a poor value week will be left with poor choices even as good, high demand weeks that owner would love to have go to non-owner venues. It simply isn't a fair trade any other way despite what some would have you believe.

The owners of the best times have to know that their deposits will result in an EQUAL value return - not just given away to anyone who happens to own a converted motel unit in South Africa or on the coast. To ensure that the exchange companies have to block those unequal trades while also making sure the great time doesn't go unused. Hopefully the newer model of points based trades will allow them to take enough points - from whatever source - to make it equal (in a way a week for week trade can't in most cases) and thus stop the need for all the rentals of leftover mud weeks and unqualified requests for the best times. The weeks systems couldn't do it fairly but we have another chance with points. Good systems like FF, Trendwest, DVC and others show it CAN be done.

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

I Fail To See How Renting of Prime Week In Prime Locations Helps Anyone

Walt - While the underlying thought - only an owner gets another timeshare owners time - is seemingly a good one it can't actually work that way 100%. If it did there would be no reason for anyone to buy a DVC or Marriott week and ever place it for a trade since that week would be snatched up by a much lower value owner. Period. There is no incentive to buy, own and support good weeks and resorts if, as the time honored sales pitch goes, owning any old cheap, off season week can trade to anywhere in the world. There has to be a leveling of value which means that an owner of a poor value week will be left with poor choices even as good, high demand weeks that owner would love to have go to non-owner venues. It simply isn't a fair trade any other way despite what some would have you believe.

The owners of the best times have to know that their deposits will result in an EQUAL value return - not just given away to anyone who happens to own a converted motel unit in South Africa or on the coast. To ensure that the exchange companies have to block those unequal trades while also making sure the great time doesn't go unused. Hopefully the newer model of points based trades will allow them to take enough points - from whatever source - to make it equal (in a way a week for week trade can't in most cases) and thus stop the need for all the rentals of leftover mud weeks and unqualified requests for the best times. The weeks systems couldn't do it fairly but we have another chance with points. Good systems like FF, Trendwest, DVC and others show it CAN be done.

I fail to see how Renting more Prime Weeks puts more weeks into either the Week's Exchange Pool or the Point's Exchange Pool. Renting Week isn't a Points or Weeks thing. If anything the Exchange Companies are using the Points System to hide how many Good to Great Weeks are being Rented.

If the Points System was so fair, why does RCI take a Week other than the Traded Week (Points Week) for buying (trading into with Points) into a Prime Week Exchange and rent a Prime Week in Prime Locations instead of the Mud Week that was use for this trade?



An Example: Madge said all of the very Large number of the Maui Embassy weeks that were rented out were needed to pay for the Points programs. Yet when asked what is equal to the Maui Embassy in March, April, and May, Madge said she can not tell us.

Right!!!

Walt

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

Points = price fixing

I have been to quite a few presentations, and I have yet to hear the sales pitch quite that broad. Yes, they do overpromise. They do tend to indicate that any red will get you any red, and that is probably most dishonest in the overbuilt areas where there is more ''phony red'' that really ought to be blue or white if RCI were honest. But I have never heard that claim for blue or white weeks. For these they push the 45-day window, which is not a trade up in a value sense, since it is distressed inventory with a short shelf life, and if nobody has taken it at that juncture, the market has spoken as to its real worth, anyway.

If you want to look at where the timeshare system is out of balance, it is not in South Africa or on the coast or in ''converted hotels''. A converted hotel in the right location, like London, Paris, New York, or St. Barths would instantly have a much better supply/demand curve than the most luxurious purpose built resort in an overbuilt area, and I think you know that.

Where is the oversupply that the system needs to deal with? The overbuilt areas. Bootleg has told us that the two resorts with the most oversupply in the entire RCI system are Gold Crowns in Orlando. Blue weeks can easily trade in there not because it is an unequal trade, but on the contrary because supply and demand curves say it is an EQUAL trade.

As to South Africa, the availibility tables in the European version of the RCI directory show that it has a much better supply/demand curve than Florida, so, yes, supply and demand (i.e. the market) clearly say that South AFrica SHOULD be able to easily trade into Florida.

Points is really a form of price fixing, and, as expected those who benefit from the way in which the prices are rigged by RCI can be expceted to loudly defend it. It is really in their self interest.

Walt - While the underlying thought - only an owner gets another timeshare owners time - is seemingly a good one it can't actually work that way 100%. If it did there would be no reason for anyone to buy a DVC or Marriott week and ever place it for a trade since that week would be snatched up by a much lower value owner. Period. There is no incentive to buy, own and support good weeks and resorts if, as the time honored sales pitch goes, owning any old cheap, off season week can trade to anywhere in the world. There has to be a leveling of value which means that an owner of a poor value week will be left with poor choices even as good, high demand weeks that owner would love to have go to non-owner venues. It simply isn't a fair trade any other way despite what some would have you believe.

The owners of the best times have to know that their deposits will result in an EQUAL value return - not just given away to anyone who happens to own a converted motel unit in South Africa or on the coast. To ensure that the exchange companies have to block those unequal trades while also making sure the great time doesn't go unused. Hopefully the newer model of points based trades will allow them to take enough points - from whatever source - to make it equal (in a way a week for week trade can't in most cases) and thus stop the need for all the rentals of leftover mud weeks and unqualified requests for the best times. The weeks systems couldn't do it fairly but we have another chance with points. Good systems like FF, Trendwest, DVC and others show it CAN be done.

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

Another point about RCI and II!

I believe there has been enough energy expended expressing that sentiment to keep Wisconsin warm for ten winters.

Realistically, not just idealistically, how do you think this can be done, force RCI to be just an exchange company again?

Cuz' after all, we all know the temptation to rent is just too great for a company like Cendant, don't we?

Hi Jim,

I also think it is important that we (Timeshare Owners) get the message to RCI and II that we (Timeshare Owners) are not as dumb and gullible as they may think.

I don't think Points Owners of other Points Programs defending RCI Rental Policy helps the RCI membership.

As an example: Dave M from Tug is overly protective of RCI yet I don't believe he is a RCI member. I believe that there are others that seem to be overly protective of RCI that also are not RCI members.

Walt

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

It sounds nice anyway. Is that an RCI exchange?

Hi Jim,

I already have it for June, 16 2007. The only problem it isn't in Paris. It is about 100 km from Paris.

Walt

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

Yes, it is a RCI!

It sounds nice anyway. Is that an RCI exchange?

I got this trade about 6 months ago with RCI. It is a 2 Bedroom. I have found out that most of my exchanges with RCI have been good trades but I also plan my vacations 1 to 2 years out. The time period 1 1/2 months seems to be the best time.

I have been very satisfied with my past and present Exchanges with RCI.



Walt

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Don't you think he is more protective of TUG than RCI? RCI being the only official industry presence on TUG, don't you think he wants to protect that relationship, not protect RCI per se?

There have been other companies that seem to have been protected also, so I think it is more about the realtionship they have or have had with TUG than about protecting the companies.

Not talking about Dave, but there are some there who just like to pick a fight, sorta pesture certain posters. You know what I mean.

As an example: Dave M from Tug is overly protective of RCI yet I don't believe he is a RCI member. I believe that there are others that seem to be overly protective of RCI that also are not RCI members.

Walt

[tennisWalt Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tennisWalt]

I Can See it Both Ways

Don't you think he is more protective of TUG than RCI? RCI being the only official industry presence on TUG, don't you think he wants to protect that relationship, not protect RCI per se?

There have been other companies that seem to have been protected also, so I think it is more about the realtionship they have or have had with TUG than about protecting the companies.

Not talking about Dave, but there are some there who just like to pick a fight, sorta pesture certain posters. You know what I mean.

I think you are right about protecting TUG. I just think it should be done on ASK RCI, not on the other Forums and Threads.

I know what you mean.

Walt

[taffy19 Gold Contributor Find all posts View Profile Close taffy19]

Don't you think he is more protective of TUG than RCI? RCI being the only official industry presence on TUG, don't you think he wants to protect that relationship, not protect RCI per se?

There have been other companies that seem to have been protected also, so I think it is more about the realtionship they have or have had with TUG than about protecting the companies.

Not talking about Dave, but there are some there who just like to pick a fight, sorta pesture certain posters. You know what I mean.

I think that you are right. RCI is over there but all the others are here and they don't want to lose RCI. They still have the most members.

Has anyone invited them over here? I doubt if they would come now after what is posted about RCI but the same issue is posted there too.

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

Until recently we had an RCI presence here but it was unofficial and therefore a better one that did not require company approval or direction for every answer.

[Carolinian Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Carolinian]

Let's look at why South Africa can so easily trade to places like Orlando. It all comes down to what really drives exchanging - supply and demand.

The European version of the RCI Resort Directory has an Availibility Table on page 25 that explains such trades. It ranks ''availible space'' into 4 categories for each month of the year:
1) limited availibility / very highly demanded
2) less availibility / highly demanded
3) good availibility
4) very good availibility
When you look at South Africa and Florida, you find the following:
Florida -
1 has 2 months
2 has 3 months
3 has 4 months
4 has 3 months
South Africa -
1 has 5 months
2 has 3 months
3 has 4 months
4 has 0 months
It is very clear that South Africa has a better supply/demand curve than Florida. It makes sense that South Africa could easily trade into Florida. Most trades from South Africa to Florida would actually be a trade down according to this data published by RCI.

Of course, lumping all of Florida together does gloss over the fact that there are individual parts of Florida that obviously have MUCH better supply/demand curves like Sanibel/Captiva and Key West than places like overbuilt Orlando.

If you want to look at real dog trading areas, the obvious one is India which ranks a ''4'' all 12 months of the year.

Walt - While the underlying thought - only an owner gets another timeshare owners time - is seemingly a good one it can't actually work that way 100%. If it did there would be no reason for anyone to buy a DVC or Marriott week and ever place it for a trade since that week would be snatched up by a much lower value owner. Period. There is no incentive to buy, own and support good weeks and resorts if, as the time honored sales pitch goes, owning any old cheap, off season week can trade to anywhere in the world. There has to be a leveling of value which means that an owner of a poor value week will be left with poor choices even as good, high demand weeks that owner would love to have go to non-owner venues. It simply isn't a fair trade any other way despite what some would have you believe.

The owners of the best times have to know that their deposits will result in an EQUAL value return - not just given away to anyone who happens to own a converted motel unit in South Africa or on the coast. To ensure that the exchange companies have to block those unequal trades while also making sure the great time doesn't go unused. Hopefully the newer model of points based trades will allow them to take enough points - from whatever source - to make it equal (in a way a week for week trade can't in most cases) and thus stop the need for all the rentals of leftover mud weeks and unqualified requests for the best times. The weeks systems couldn't do it fairly but we have another chance with points. Good systems like FF, Trendwest, DVC and others show it CAN be done.