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nursetanya1973 · 06-13-2006, 08:58 PM

As I was reading that thread, I kept waiting for the part where they banned you. Hence the vacation part. It did seem as if you were going to get your hand slapped. Shame on you for instigating arguments.

Boy, people do get their panties in a bunch, don't they?

Tanya

lawren2 · 06-13-2006, 09:41 PM

Pot stirring at it's best.

Is it me or has Vickie totally gone off the deep end this time? No more trading studios for larger units at OLCC and ALL exchangers get West Village only. Pardon me but it is NONE of their business what I use to trade in AND OLCC is not the only fish in that pond.

How many thousands of weeks are available there?

Sounds like the tail is trying to wag the dog again.

Not that OLCC or Orlando is in my exchange wish list any time soon.

Steve · 06-13-2006, 09:46 PM

TUG bashing again

I thought that Ken and Frank made it quite clear recently that they did not want people to come here and bash TUG. Did I misunderstand something?

Isn't that exactly what this thread is doing? There are good reasons for Jim's "vacation". This is not the place to discuss nor to debate them, however.

Indeed, the only reason for this thread is to stir up the latent "anti TUG" sentiment that exists among some on this board. Is that really what TS4MS is all about?

Steve

JLB · 06-13-2006, 09:48 PM

I'm not looking for sympathy. I'm fully aware that when a particular person pulls my chain, and keeps pulling it, and keeps pulling it, I will pull theirs. Everyone knows that, that I will not sit still for endless personal criticism, snobishness, etc.

I didn't say anything too bad, but if you'll notice I agree I had overstepped the strict rules laid out for me Over Yonder, so I went back 29 minutes later to edit my statements. Yes, there is a different set of rules for me, I know that, and I should have known I had violated them.

By the time I went back to edit my comments, 29 minutes, I was toast. How's that for sitting on thread waiting to pull the trigger?

People ask about the difference between web-sites, and this threads points it out. Not what led up to the problem, but what has gone on after. Check out all the piling on after I became defenseless. It is one thing to reprimand someone, but another to rub salt into the wounds.

It is certainly unprofessional.

As I have found in the past, the desire to control others words and thoughts Over Yonder has stretched outside of their own domain, so I will likely be reprimanded further for speaking here.

I do not fault those Over Yonder. Rather, I feel sorry for them, that they seem so limited in their choice actions. It's as if I eventually will be aggravated into doing what I will eventually do and in return they do the only thing they know how to do.

It's like the only thing they know how to do is let the train wreck happen, because they know how to clean up train wrecks.

I have asked if they can block me and Vickie, as has been done here, to avoid this problem in the future, if there is a future. When two people don't get along, but those two people do OK with others, why not just block those two?

That's a great idea brought forward by TS4Ms, and I can't quit saying enough about it.

To set the record straight, again, I have never had a bad vacation at OL, but some of those representing it Over Yonder make me want to puke. They can't be doing good for OL the way they bash others.

I'll be down on the dock if you need me.

JLB · 06-13-2006, 10:01 PM

Steve:

I have not followed the recent discussion about anti-TUG sentiment.

The last one I noticed it got into a sorta site policy debate and was moved to the Political forum.

If there are topics that are censored here, now, I apologize.

I have discussed the problem of oversealous LOLs here before and it did not become an anti-TUG thread as I recall. That thread was about the way LOL's insult other posters Over Yonder. A lot of people here agreed.

Tell me how to discuss a problem Over Yonder, as a service to others, without it becoming an anti-TUG discussion.

Like I say, I didn't come here to whine and I realize anything I say sounds like whining, but everyone needs a place to go.

How can we keep from becoming like those we don't want to be like if we don't discuss how that is? Can we do that without making it personal?

Now I'm going to the dock, and if when I come back this is gone, so be it.

lawren2 · 06-13-2006, 10:38 PM

Originally posted by Steve

I thought that Ken and Frank made it quite clear recently that they did not want people to come here and bash TUG. Did I misunderstand something?

Isn't that exactly what this thread is doing? There are good reasons for Jim's "vacation". This is not the place to discuss nor to debate them, however.

Indeed, the only reason for this thread is to stir up the latent "anti TUG" sentiment that exists among some on this board. Is that really what TS4MS is all about?

Steve

Steve

I don't believe I was bashing TUG. I owe TUG a lot of my timeshare education and would not ever speak poorly of them as a group.

There are OLCC "cheerleaders" that I don't favor and since posting anything negative about that resort is not welcome Over Yonder, I express myself here. I was going to post about that thread individually but someone beat me too it.

I am sorry that you took my post as being anti-anywhere but I leave my statement as is.

shopgirl · 06-14-2006, 08:48 AM

I hope OLCC does put owners into the worst sections

I hope they put all exchangers into the units on So. Magnolia Ct., with their small ugly tubs, broken and stained tiles, old appliances, ants and roaches, and those annoying yellow porch lights that you cannot turn off.

If all exchangers get those units, and a large percentage of those exchangers fill out RCI's comment cards, no more GC for them! Because honestly, there are 30 or 40 resorts in Orlando that are just better than OLCC's older units, some that are rated only Hospitality.

I know this will offend some of you OLCC owners. If so, why not be proactive and during your next visit, ask to seek a unit near #2624. Not a nice unit at all, everything is old and worn out. Plain vanilla is the way one other exchanger described it. I would call it worth only Hospitality worthy, if that. Yet they get GC because they keep building and building and building.....Ridiculous!

JLB · 06-14-2006, 10:15 AM

Having Had a Night to Sleep on It

"Let me sleep on it, Baby, Baby!
Let me sleep on it.
Let me sleep on it.
I'll give you my answer in the mor-or-ning."

Meatloaf

To me TUG is just another topic, just something else to talk about. TS4Ms seems to have found a way to talk about every other topic under the sun, keeping everyone's sensibilities in mind, so that not one person using the site is forced to view one comment they don't want to, so it would be inconsistent to disallow this topic.

I don't believe it is the topic that creates a problem, but how people go about discussing them. If there is a problem on another site, or anywhere in our lives, we all like to come here, hang out with friends, and talk about it. It's our Cheers.

A short history lessen. Yes, I was a RAT Over Yonder. That stands for Respect, Acceptance, and Tolerance, what we all wanted. When TStips launched, Scott was emailing and on the phone with me to make the switch. I didn't. I held out that TUG would change, that it would become a place for all. I did so because of the wealth of information already on that site, stuff that it will take years to accumulate.

I also believe in everything I do that the best friend of the truth is time.

I did not even register at tips because I saw that the bulk of the discussion, and it's reason for being, was TUG-bashing. That is not a sound foundation and not something I approve of. I'm afraid that my reluctance toward tips strained the warm relationship and comraderie I had with Scott. Only when I saw that, his frustration with me, I signed up.

I behaved similarly when TS4Ms started, reluctant to get involved and I turned down a Moderator position, largely because of the possible TUG conflict. Mostly because of the makeup of personalities forebode an eventual problem here.

But TS4Ms appears to be bigger than that. It's reason for being is not TUG-bashing. It is not just a place for disgruntled TUGgers to hang out and whine. It is much more than that. The administrators here have proven to be a different breed and capable of sorting thing out, not taking sides. TS4Ms appears to know how to deal with all the baggage.

I have asked the TUG administrators to set it so that Vickie and I cannot see what each other says, as the administrators have here with another person. They said they won't.

If you would search my posts you will see that I do not dwell on TUG, I do not bash them endlessly, just like on TUG I do not dwell on Vickie or bash her endlessly. The bulk of my posts are about other topics. If you focus on just my comments in those areas, then you are missing me. I can't do anything about that.

So, to me, TUG is just another topic, one to be discussed fairly and honestly. You will notice that my posts have to do with Vickie, the way she insults so many people. The way that TUG as an organization comes into play is that it appears to support her conduct by allowing it to continue and disciplining those who try to do something about it.

Surely we can find a way to discuss this topic without upsetting anyone. Perhaps like I am being told Over Yonder, if you really don't like the place (OL), don't go there. See, that's missing the point, too.

Anyway, there's an Ignore feature here. If someone thinks I'm just the worst person they ever didn't meet, a pot-stirring rabble-rouser, they can use it, or they can ask to never see anything I say again.

Again, if this topic is supposed to be placed somewhere and I missed that, I apologize.

BocaBum99 · 06-14-2006, 10:32 AM

JLB,

I didn't know you got another forced vacation. Sorry to hear that. I posted a question over there for you, but now I know you can't respond.

For the record, I like what you post, especially when it stirs the pot. Because then, I don't feel so alone. LOL.

I guess you were right about what our discussion of banana splits would do. Thanks for the tip about staying away from that topic.

The Conch Man · 06-14-2006, 11:25 AM

Steve ~~ I don't know you or know bout you ~~ But ~~ I can say this ~~~~~~~ " G E T ~ A ~ L I F E " ~~ Ifin you are one of them Tuggers over yonder then I really don't want to know you ~~ This isn't bashin ~~ all tho I wish it was ~~

Post edited by QB:

JLB · 06-14-2006, 11:34 AM

Despite what some may think, I have stifled myself from personal attacks concerning LOLs Over Yonder. I have tried to address the issue without attacking anyone, by discussing issues, linking to others, elsewhere, saying the same thing as those on TUG who have been insulted for doing so..

What irked me this time, what did me in, is that I started a new thread explicitly to collect information from exchangers, from now on, in response to the announcement that Vickie made about all exchangers being placed in the West Village. She said that in another thread and I did not want to attack her or detract from that thread.

I asked in my OP of the new thread not to contaminate it with idle chatter, that could be done on the other thread.

But she did.

So, I started another thread, apologetically because I knew that was pushing the rules, but I explained why I was doing that, to let that one be the information gathering thread, and let the idle chatter go to one of the other two.

But she cluttered that thread up, too.

It takes two to tangle. I was intentionally and specifically targeted and disrespected. It has been going on for more than two years, much like a problem I had with another person for four years. Everyone can see that, and I have unsolicited emails from several, several who are also fed up, not with TUG, but with Vickie.

It's as simple as I pick on her because I do not like the way she insults people, her condescending attitude, because it spoils folks' visit to TUG, and she picks on me in return.

So, I spoke out, not bad, not naming names, and not anything anyone else would be repimanded for, but more than I am allowed to do.

NativeCracker · 06-14-2006, 12:10 PM

Originally posted by JLB

It takes two to tangle. I was intentionally and specifically targeted and disrespected. It has been going on for more than two years, much like a problem I had with another person for four years. Everyone can see that, and I have unsolicited emails from several, several who are also fed up, not with TUG, but with Vickie.

It's as simple as I pick on her because I do not like the way she insults people, her condescending attitude, because it spoils folks' visit to TUG, and she picks on me in return.

So, I spoke out, not bad, not naming names, and not anything anyone else would be repimanded for, but more than I am allowed to do.

I'm brand new to this Board but am a veteran Over Yonder. Jim is absolutely right that Vickie is allowed to be as insulting and condescending as she chooses (I've been victimized by her ascerbic posts more than once) with no repercussions. The mildest criticism of OLCC triggers instant personal insults and demeaning comments. It's extremely hard to stay polite when presented with her assaults. I think Jim does a pretty good job of putting her in her place without being hateful in the process. I don't understand why he's been suspended but she's allowed to continue on. It's patently unfair, IMHO.

shopgirl · 06-14-2006, 06:23 PM

Vickie is the problem on TUG, that is for sure

She is the only person that has personally offended me, in all of my thousands of posts on that site. As a matter of fact, my first post was about OLCC, when someone asked about the resort, and I was lambasted with insults. The units on So. Magnolia Ct. do not have large whirlpool tubs, but she had to say something about how she and hubby can fit into one of the tubs, with a little winky winky smiley attached.

The tub was a regular tub with jets, not a tub meant for two, by any stretch of the imagination. Two young children could have fit, but not adults. She just did it again in her recent posts, made a comment about how she and hubby could fit into the OLCC tubs. Well, I guarantee she was not in the same unit we had.

That is insulting. Yet she is allowed to say, "we fit in, so I don't know why you don't," continuing to infer that any of us who cannot fit into the OLCC tubs must not be slim and trim, as she and hubby are. That is not my problem, believe me, I can fit into any of the tubs at any of the other resorts, even the DVC whirlpools, which are smaller than many.

People who like to grill burgers and steaks on our vacations are another target for her attacks. When "Shoney" was asking about local restaurants and whether the resort had grills, Vickie made a comment about "those kinds of people," referring to those who grill or go to casual restaurants, like Denny's. It was also insulting. She was editted by Dave for that one. Then when Shoney got back from OLCC, she had a unit she called "plain vanilla." She thought it was nothing special, even though Vickie bragged and bragged before her stay. She bought into that stuff because Vickie is an owner and she thought an owner would know more than the rest of us.

The constant comebacks and ganging up on exchangers at OLCC who express their opinions, based on their own experiences, are keeping many of us from saying what we want. When people ask about OLCC and want some honest opinions, the only thing I can say to them without getting insulted by several owners is, "our experience was less than stellar, but you could have a totally different stay, depending on which part of the resort you get." Even then, Vickie made a comment about how I abhor OLCC. I do not abhor OLCC. I do abhor the defenders of the resort who tell me I am lying about the tile color, the size of the tub and the fact that my unit had no hair dryer.

Rick is a Denver firefighter of 31 years, close to retirement, though he is now only 51 (same as me

, high school sweethearts). Because of his profession, sleep is light and is disturbed by the slightest noises, and lights are even worse. He could not sleep at OLCC because the yellow porchlight could not be turned off. The light through the windows gave the illusion that it was daytime, all night long! We called about the light and they said it had to remain on. Shutting the curtains did not work, they were not room-darkening curtains. He could never stay in that part of the resort again. We noticed that other areas did not have those lights.

I am one of the people who support JLB via emails. I see no reason for him to leave the OLCC subject alone, as many others do. I think you have a completely different experience as an exchanger over owning because OLCC didn't care about any concerns we had with our unit when we called. They told us we could not unscrew the lightbulb on the patio, and too bad that they shut off the elevator on check-out morning from 9-11 a.m., with us on the fifth floor and moving to another unit, with lots of groceries and extra stuff to lug down the stairs.

I was only able to make it up the stairs once to get more stuff, poor Rick had to go three times after our first trip. I guess he is a fireman, but geez, he worked up a sweat.

As far as the newest comments about going elsewhere, if you don't like it, we probably always will choose other places, especially if we have no chance of getting a unit with a large tub. There are lots of great resorts near Disney that have all of the niceties in the unit, which is really most important for us. WE have Disney to keep us occupied, and we have annual passes. Pools are an okay amenity, but we like to have more space when we use them. Vacation Village at Parkway is one of the resorts we exchange into that has practically empty pools, and they are very nice. We will put on our suits and go down, in the middle of dinner hour, when all others are heading to the parks for various fireworks shows.

But I will continue to post my opinions about OLCC when people ask, because Vickie and Gary and even Mel are owners and cannot speak to the exchange experience. To them I would say, "get a life," because in the end, defending your positions by calling others liars is not getting you any points in the debate. Tony is generally pretty fair and has emailed me privately on occasion to say that he knows how rude Vickie's comments can be. He also told me that I am right, the units on So. Magnolia Ct. only have regular-sized tubs, not the larger ones meant for two. Tony owns at my favorite resort, Shearwater on Kauai, so he can't be all that bad.

Sydney · 06-14-2006, 08:23 PM

Originally posted by Steve

This is not the place to discuss nor to debate them, however.
Steve

Ahh, Steve, I think you do a great job on TUG so maybe you should stick to moderating and reprimanding people over there instead of trying to enforce your TUG rules over here.

To clarify, I have absolutely nothing against TUG, but you slapping people's wrist over here and telling them that this forum is not the place to discuss it really steps over the line a tad wee bit.

Let us worry about it, hey? Thanks mate.

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