Trust on TUG

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

If you thought there is trust on TUG, you know, an understanding, a pact, a mutual protection society, etc.

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35012

[nursetanya1973 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close nursetanya1973]

Very interesting indeed.

[I-DE-HO Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close I-DE-HO]

If you thought there is trust on TUG, you know, an understanding, a pact, a mutual protection society, etc.

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35012

I'm not sure why you posted this info. What is your purpose? Any forum that has 1000's of members will have these types of squabbles. I don't think it says anything negative about TUG. People are people and disagreements will always be the norm. It makes life interesting.

Phil

[JLB Please excuse me, I'm a Dick. Not a moron just a Dick Find all posts View Profile Close JLB]

Ouch!

8 years and 15000 posts on these forums and I still find myself having to explain the meaning of statements that have obvious meaning, obvious especially to the experienced.

But here it is. It is here because it could not be there.

Some people think that because they belong to TUG, or TS4Ms, or some other Internet group, that there is a common bond that works to the benefit of all.

That is not the case. There always has been and always will be snitches, people who do not have others' best interest in mind, on TUG, on TS4Ms, or any message board, people you cannot trust.

If it was high school, they would be the hall monitors.

In this particular instance, it is irritating to many that they would snitch on an individual, while at the same time condoning and defending worse conduct by the exchange company, committing the same offense, only on a wholesale scale.

I'm not sure why you posted this info. What is your purpose? Any forum that has 1000's of members will have these types of squabbles. I don't think it says anything negative about TUG. People are people and disagreements will always be the norm. It makes life interesting.

Phil

[Spence Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Spence]

Well, I consider myself experienced, and have several posts in that OY thread. I certainly don't condone and defend worse conduct by the exchange company, committing the same offense, only on a wholesale scale.

And I didn't understand your OP.

[Keitht Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Keitht]

There always has been and always will be snitches, people who do not have others' best interest in mind, on TUG, on TS4Ms, or any message board, people you cannot trust.

In this particular instance, it is irritating to many that they would snitch on an individual, while at the same time condoning and defending worse conduct by the exchange company, committing the same offense, only on a wholesale scale.

I didn't read anywhere on the original thread any threats to report individuals to the exchange companies. There were some pretty strong feelings expressed, and warnings of what could happen if the Exchange Company involved knew what was going on. Explaining that to the OP was in my opinion actually doing them a service, and did have their best interests at heart. I suspect the OP would far rather get accommodation through a permissible route than arrive at resort to be told that they have no entitlement to occupy.
The fact that the exchange companies may or may not be acting in a certain way doesn't change the fact that their terms and conditions specifically forbid the renting out of exchanged weeks. The person making the original exchange should know that, and it is their own fault if they haven't protected themselves against the possibility of not being able to occupy.
Legitimate questions were asked when the moderator of the board said that he had removed certain sections of the OP to stop the resort and/or exchange company being identified. I, like Spence, wondered on what authority the post had been modified. If the mods can simply edit any post when and how they like it is worrying. A fuller explanation was then given of the sequence of events that led to the edit.
People selling on exchange weeks is bound to have an effect on general availability and should be discouraged in my opinion.

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

Rumor has it that some people have been reported in the past for renting out exchanges. IMHO, whether that is the right thing to do would depend on whether the individual renting out those exchanges was doing so in quantity and for profit on a regular basis. Some people, for their own self interest would snitch on other group members, while others might do so out of personal animosity. Anyone renting an exchange should be aware of the ramifications and do so at their own peril.

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

Ouch!

8 years and 15000 posts on these forums and I still find myself having to explain the meaning of statements that have obvious meaning, obvious especially to the experienced.

But here it is. It is here because it could not be there.

Some people think that because they belong to TUG, or TS4Ms, or some other Internet group, that there is a common bond that works to the benefit of all.

That is not the case. There always has been and always will be snitches, people who do not have others' best interest in mind, on TUG, on TS4Ms, or any message board, people you cannot trust.

If it was high school, they would be the hall monitors.

In this particular instance, it is irritating to many that they would snitch on an individual, while at the same time condoning and defending worse conduct by the exchange company, committing the same offense, only on a wholesale scale.

If this was the original intent of your OP, I didn't get that from it either.

I do agree that there are a few Tuggers/TS4Mers who turn in fellow members into exchange companies. I have always suspected it, but now I know it for a fact. Now, I suspect that it is those owners that are the real police force for exchange companies.

I don't blame them really. They are ticked off that others are taking what they believe is theirs, even though it isn't. It's the same concept of playing blackjack and someone splits a pair and one of those cards would have helped the next person. That person doesn't get the card they need, loses the hand and blame the person who split their pair for losing. It turns out the odds are their odds for winning were same whether or not the person took "their" card.

As I've said in other posts, not allowing rentals is more a function of a system that would collapse if it were done in a widespread way. Look at RCI. Their system is deteriorating because they are the ones renting in masse. A sound exchange system would easily be able to withstand rentals. In fact, it would be bolstered by them.

[BocaBum99 Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close BocaBum99]

Rumor has it that some people have been reported in the past for renting out exchanges. IMHO, whether that is the right thing to do would depend on whether the individual renting out those exchanges was doing so in quantity and for profit on a regular basis. Some people, for their own self interest would snitch on other group members, while others might do so out of personal animosity. Anyone renting an exchange should be aware of the ramifications and do so at their own peril.

I agree with everything you say in this post except for quantity. It is either wrong for everyone or right for everyone. I don't buy logic that says it's okay if it's a small owner just trying to recoup their MF due to hardship, but it's wrong if some smart entrepreneur figured out how to make money doing it. That would be one less person that other taxpayers would have to support due to a lost job in an industry that it doesn't make any sense for Americans to be in anymore anyway.

[shopgirl Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close shopgirl]

I didn't see anything to make me think that others are turning people in?

Just because I am against renting of exchanges does not mean I am out there turning people in. Before I found TUG 1 1/2 years ago, I turned in several people who were renting out weeks at PAHIO @ Bali Hai on various sites. RCI does not seem to care and actually will tell you that they police all rental sites for violators, so do not worry about it. As I said OY, I have to compete with RCI and do not care to compete with every exchanger with my rentals. I specifically bought three of our weeks to rent out for a while, at least as long as I can still trade into Hawaii with our Colorado weeks.

I always see some PAHIO weeks for rent that were exchanges and told one of the persons that renting exchanges was against the rules. She had two almost expire, then reset the dates for later next month. She is renting the weeks on redweek and was even able to grab a three bedroom that she rented already. She told me she is just trying to recover her costs of owning a timeshare she cannot use. That is fine if you want to recover costs, but buy an HGVC and reserve something in Hawaii and rent it. That way you don't break the rules and are not competing against me and my rentals.

[nursetanya1973 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close nursetanya1973]

Guess I misunderstood you too, Jim. I thought you were referring to the fact that higher-ups on TUG were working to hide the identity of someone breaking rules. It seems like a lot of work to do all that editing of everyone's post to protect a rule breaker's identity. Another example of the "old boy" (or girl) network OY.

And yes, I do understand why it was done.

[tonyg Goomba & Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close tonyg]

RCI has the tools to indicate who may be renting out exchanges and they use them to find these people. They may also use leads from members. You need a guest certificate for someone else to use your week and if that week is an exchanged week, you a a potential rule breaker. If you have 20 of them in 2 years, RCI will certainly be investigating. I don't think they need any help to find abusers of the system.

[littlestar Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close littlestar]

It sounds like the person who listed this just couldn't go and is trying to get some money back out of it. Never the less, it is against the rules and I wouldn't want any part of it. It's not worth the potential problems in my book.

I personally think somebody running a business for profit of renting high end exchanges is not really playing nice. If they want to do that, why don't they start their own exchange company and make their own rules instead of breaking somebody else's?

Not to mention the tax issues with major renting. Disney has really tightened up on this issue (renting their inventory as a business) and I think it's got everything to do with taxes. I would be absoutely sick if as a DVC member I had to start paying occupancy taxes on my already hefty dues because a bunch of people were cheating on paying taxes using Disney inventory. I think Disney is actually watching this closer than what most people think. I remember seeing some adds on Ebay a few months ago with major amounts of DVC inventory -(you could tell it was exchanges because they were asking for the $95 fee and it was 7 nights and way too cheap to be DVC members) and when I looked at it a couple of days later, it was gone. So somebody, either Disney or II shut it down would be my guess.

Another thing Disney has stopped members from doing is getting multiple transfers a year. Now we are limited to 1 in or out a year. I received an e-mail from Disney that eluded to the fact that the reason for this was because of the commercial renting.

[shopgirl Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close shopgirl]

There are some DVC owners that rent a lot of those 5-day studios. I rented one to see what Old Key West was like. A studio is just not the same as a one bedroom.

You should look at Redweek.com for Disney rentals. It is a real problem. I know these are exchanges, they are for specific weeks, most not too far away.

There is a new poster on that thread who is saying he/she rents weeks and was blasted for it. Well, I know I used strong language but I always do. I am too emotional and timeshares are not supposed to be emotional, so I apologized. That is me! Rick lives with this emotional wreck. Feel very, very sorry for him.

[Spence Super Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Spence]

Poor Rick.