Universal Vacation Club (Villa del Palmar) - Questions about Upgrading to VPA???

[lisamdvm Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close lisamdvm]

Hello to all the UVC Member Family~http://www.timeshareforums.com/forum...n_rolleyes.gif

I am soliciting some advice and help!!http://www.timeshareforums.com/forum...n_confused.gif

I am also a member and until recently I have been very happy with my membership. That is, until I have been looking online & there is so much negative stuff out there about UVC - it scares me a little bit about my purchase. I have also been in contact with Jeff Robbins & read quite a bit on his website as well (VERY informative & eye opening, scary!)....Anyway, we purchased our "piece of the pie" in Feb 2008 while we were at VDP - Cabo, and of course, probably paid a too much since we weren't planning on buying a timeshare the day of the presentation (like 98% of the other suckers!) and didn't have any sort of bargaining cap on (live & learn!). So we have the "entry level" purchase, which is just fine (Gold Member summer studio floating week) - we paid 13,000+ whatever random charges to close the deal. We are completely bought & paid for minus the ever increasing maintenance fees annually-which we were expecting). Anyway, I have been now to Cabo once (the trip we bought), & PV 3 times (2 times @ PV downtown & 1 time @ Flamingos) and Traded 1 week to go to Aruba (I liked the Villa resorts MUCH better & we had stayed at a Mariott resort, WAY too big & very expensive...). I love the Villa resorts & love vacationing in Mexico, everything has always been very nice & I haven't had too much trouble booking so far, but we have always gone in either May or Oct.

Anyway, on my last trip this past May (I was there with 3 of my girlfriends) I went to the owner update & got the pitch about VPA & the points system. It all sounded really good & I was tempted to upgrade, but my husband was not there & I wanted a little time to come home & research the deal etc. I was planning on going again in Oct with my husband, my baby, my parents, & his parents, and to be honest, I was thinking of upgrading & having my parents buy in/share with me in our membership....until I started looking here online :-( So, now here is my situation....I do want to continue vacationing with the Villa Group, I love the resorts, but now I know that the summer studio doesn't meet all my needs, give me enough flexibility, etc. I know I want at least a 1BDR unit guaranteed, instead of renting the studio & having to wait until 60 days out to pay for an upgrade & hoping something is available. I also know that the price of the 1-2 bedroom upgrade varies quite a bit & also varies from resort to resort, which is fine. We got upgrade to a 1 BDR for free at one of our visits when we arrived, which was nice, but certainly can't rely on that to happen all of the time.

So, I am trying to find a way to make "lemonade out of a lemon" per say. I know that I would financially be better off to rent a unit from a current member on one of the online timeshare rental sites, especially, if we want to bring people along. However, I have also been told that my current purchase is really "worth nothing" & would be difficult to sell/rent etc. I know I do not want to buy any separate unit & have two places/maintenance fees, etc. I can't just "give this unit away" to someone either - $13,000 was a lot of money for us, and even though it is completely bought & paid for, we certainly haven't used all that we have paid in 3 years. And, I am not willing to just caulk it up as a loss & start over. I feel like my only option is to upgrade so that at least I have more flexibility & am guaranteed a bigger unit - but it makes me sick to think of paying the over-inflated prices to a greedy developer at one of those slimy sales presentations. Especially when you can find units on sale all over the place on line for pennies on the dollar, or you can buy VPA - points on line for pennies on the dollar as well - but in my current Gold Membership, I am not qualified to use points. At least in an upgrade I will get the "depreciation value" for my purchase (which I don't understand how it depreciates, since they are still selling the exact same merchandise to other people for more that what I paid for it...), which will "roll over" into a new unit upgrade, but I am trying to make the most value for the money we have already spent. I'm wondering if the best possible thing to do would be to upgrade to another summer studio to at least get onto the points system & then look on-line to e-bay or craig's list to buy additional points so we can upgrade to bigger rooms, different times of the year etc. Any advice??

Thanks in advance!
Lisa

[Rick Lasker Member Find all posts View Profile Close Rick Lasker]

Hi Lisa

There are a lot of scary post in the internet regarding Villa del Palmar and to be honest most of it is true ( I work for a company which cancels timeshares so.. I do know about this guys!) , yet if you purchased your timeshare with Villa del Palmar to use it and not as an investment then you don't have to worry.

Truth be told. Timeshare memberships are not very valuable in the market, they depreciate their value very rapidly and are really difficult to sell; but if you like to go to the sames places every year it is a good purchase!. Besides VP has good resorts.

Let me know if you have more questions.

Ricardo.

[bmunsell Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close bmunsell]

Hi Lisa,

You pose a great question, is there a good way to upgrade, either to the points system or to a better unit without going through the developer and resort sales people?

We also love our 1 bedroom unit and love our holiday time frame, but I am also attracted to the whole VPA and points thing. I do know that we just will not go through the developer and the sale people again for anything.

So far in my research I have not found a way to upgrade outside of their system and I would really like to, it would be like a great counter scam, but perfectly legal and above board.

take care

Barry

[itchyfeet Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close itchyfeet]

Look at the resale market for a two bedroom winter gold membership. We bought ours for a fraction of the developer price. There is very little difference between the gold week's membership and the points membership Our resort is Villa del Palmar Flamingos, but we had no trouble booking at Villa del Arco. However, you must book VDA much further in advance since it seems to be a very popular resort. You say that you don't want to just give your curret week away, but you have to look at the bottom line. If you can upgrade to a 2 bedroom resale unit for a lot less than upgrading to points, then give your studio away with no regrets. Send me a PM and I'll give you the details of our purchase.

[beach.bar.bob Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close beach.bar.bob]

Lisa -

First of all it sounds like you've been using your membership and enjoying your time at the Villa Group resorts. You mentioned you've been happy until you read some things online. I would think your personal experiences should override what you read. Personally, we've had nothing but great experiences at the Villa Group resorts ... in total so far we've stayed twelve weeks in Villa Group resorts. I've reviewed Jeff's website too, but it doesn't change my positive view.

Please do not throw more money at this situation. Upgrading your current membership to a VPA membership would be a poor choice...IMHO.

Background:

My family loves the Villa Group resorts...we've spent many happy, enjoyable weeks there including several before we purchased a membership. We bought because we want to stay there and intend to stay there. I believe we own our memberships for the right reasons.

I own three weeks of UVC (Villa Group) memberships:

1) My original membership is currently a 2900 point VPA membership which is equivalent to a Gold 2 bedroom Winter floating week. I originally purchased a Gold membership for $36,000 in 2009 just weeks before they converted to the points system. When the VPA program was announced a short time later, I was allowed via UVC member services in San Diego to upgrade to the VPA program for a "mere" $1,500. So, I have $37,500 invested in this membership.

2) A Gold 2 bedroom Winter floating membership...essentially the exact membership I originally bought except this one was purchased via eBay in October 2010 for $1,200 including all closing/transfer costs. This membership cost the original purchaser $29,900 in 2005.

3) A Gold Fixed week 3 bedroom oceanfront penthouse in Flamingos. I recently purchased this membership via eBay for $500. $1.00 to buy and $499 in closing/transfer fees. This membership cost the original purchaser $106,000 in 2004.

Look carefully at what I paid for weeks 2 and 3 versus what the original purchasers paid. That's the real market realities for timeshares. Pay no attention to the timeshare sales reps when they discuss your "equity" and how much it has or will "depreciate". These are merely internal accounting numbers used to muddy the water and create a sense of urgency for you to act before your membership becomes "worth" even less. These numbers have no relationship to the real world. The market reality is that it's already worth very little outside the walls of the timeshare sales room.

Also, understand that you can NOT purchase VPA points memberships via resale for pennies on the dollar. Or, more accurately, you can purchase them, but you CAN'T transfer them into your name. In November of 2010, I purchased via eBay a 2200 point VPA membership. After months of waiting, I was informed in May of 2011 that UVC would not transfer the VPA membership to me. They will only transfer a VPA membership to a new owner as a Premier membership (if you don't know, Premier memberships are what were sold before Gold memberships). I've since made many calls to UVC and spoken with several levels of management.

Here's the current (as of August 2011) UVC position on resales:
1) Premier memberships will transfer as Premier memberships.
2) Gold memberships will transfer as Gold memberships, but transfers/resales will be marked as not eligible for upgrade to the VPA points program.
3) VPA memberships will transfer as Premier memberships.

Current UVC management wants to protect what they perceive as the value of VPA memberships by essentially making it impossible to transfer VPA memberships. In my opinion, that makes a VPA membership much less valuable than a Gold membership in the resale market.

Okay, enough background!! On to your situation....

So, you spent $13,000 and are the proud owners of a summer studio week. You've had it a while and like the resorts enough to consider increasing your level of ownership. Personally, I think that's great. After all, I've certainly increased my level of ownership for exactly the same reason. They are great resorts...the Cancun resort is also great if you haven't been there yet.

Option 1:
This is certainly easy but also expensive. Next visit to one of the resorts go to the member update and agree to upgrade to the VPA membership...you didn't say what they quoted you for upgrading your current Gold membership to a VPA membership, but I wrote in this thread (6th message down) what I learned last spring http://www.timeshareforums.com/forum...rnational.html about upgrades.

Let's just say for yucks that they want $5000 to upgrade you from Gold to VPA. Fine, if that's all you do then you own 1,000 VPA points ... just enough for the same summer studio week you already owned. That's not really what you want, as you'd like to perhaps use a 1 or 2 bedroom instead of a studio and maybe even visit in the winter instead of summer. So you decide to upgrade an additional 1200 points which will enable you to reserve a two bedroom unit in the summer or a 1 bedroom unit in the winter. A pretty reasonable upgrade in my opinion, the next logical upgrade for you I would think. And what does this cost? At the rate they quoted me last February ($10 per point), this will cost you an additional $12,000. Wow! Really?? What a good deal for only an additional $17,000!! Not !! ($5000 to upgrade from Gold to VPA and $12,000 for the additional 1200 points). So, you push back and negotiate and finally, being the big-hearted timeshare sharks that they are they agree to sell you the 1200 point upgrade for $12,000 and also waive the $5000 fee and give you free sunset cruises for you, your husband, your baby, your parents and your hubby's parents. Such a deal! Now you own a 2200 point VPA membership, you've leveraged your initial $13,000 purchase (so you feel good about not wasting your original investment) and on top of that you had free sunset cruises with free drinks all for the total investment of $25,000. Everyone's happy, especially the big-hearted timeshare shark cuz he knows he screwed you again. (sorry, but he did).

Option 2.
Rescind your current Gold summer studio week...that's right, just give it right back to UVC. Yes, I know this is hard, you're walking away from a $13,000 investment. Again, I know this is tough, but it's the right decision. Then, buy a Gold two bedroom Winter week on eBay. On August 30, 2011 one sold for $497 plus $499 in closing and transfer costs. A total investment of $996...let's call it an even $1,000. Here's the completed listing on eBay 2-BR Cabo VILLA DEL PALMAR Mexico WINTER Gold TIMESHARE | eBay

For discussion sake, let's say you can replicate this purchase. If you do , at the end of the day, you own a Gold 2 bedroom Winter floating week which is equivalent in almost every way shape and form to my 2900 point VPA membership. The differences between Gold and VPA are inconsequential...I know, I own and use both. All the same banking, borrowing, splitting, upgrading, gold time, etc benefits.

Compare the expense of option 1 = $25,000 (original $13,000 plus $12,000) versus the expense of option 2 = $14,000 (original $13,000 plus $1,000) Compare the Gold versus VPA membership differences (minimal). Compare how many sunset cruises you can buy for your family for $11,000. Or consider that the savings will pay your maintenance fees for approximately 11 years...Now that's valuable! Not to mention that you own a two bedroom winter week, you'd need to upgrade an additional 700 points to the 2900 point level to own the equivalent in a VPA membership for another $7,000. Another seven years of maintenance fees.

Of course...this is all just my humble opinion...but I've worked through the options many times for my own personal usage and I just can't see how the upgrade to a VPA membership can ever make sense when the Gold memberships are so freely and cheaply available.

Good luck with your decision.

Safe travels.

bbb

[deb21 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close deb21]

Nice job on this post. Looks like you have done your homework. Member for 8 years and have used it 4 years. I have 4 weeks banked.

[easyrider Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close easyrider]

I would not upgrade to VPA. You can do everything you need with the membership you have. We have 4 premiere memberships and I have not had any problems reserving at any of the UVC resorts.